Natural England pulling up trees

[tommer9]

As i understand it the problem with mans intervention in moorland (which was the OP's original referral) is the drainage of said morland to create shooting grounds. Moorland is generally wetter than heathland (where one sees abundances of lizards and snakes etc) and would not necessarily support a woodland as such- peaty soils, sphagnum bogs etc etc, so the trees you have mentioned may not be that natural to the environment in its raw state....it ius only the draining of these moors to support profitable shoots that has allowed these species to successfully establish themselves.

 

If that makes sense.

[Perkins]

 

Not spent much time in the hills have you?

 

I live on a Hill farm surrounded by moorland in the North York Moors, so what do you think.

 

Do you not think that woodland is a better environment for all native species, given that the British Isles has been entirely covered in trees for the majority of its history?

 

@ jpbeaver, yes I agree but the abnormally large population of weasels etc wouldn't exist without the introduced game birds to feed off. A natural balance would occur.

 

......Meanwhile back on topic. Some really interesting and thought provoking points here. Janey, Chris sheppard, Paul Barton, tommer9 thanks for your input.

Hamadryad I'll keep you posted if I get a response.

[screwie]

my question too the original poster (perkins) is your main gripe, the fact that this is happening on moorland or the fact that it is happening on a shooting moor?!

you say that you see moorland just as de-forested land however the same can be said for any other bit of land in the uk. i think you will find that moorland has a vast array of fauna and flora species. most of which you will find on moorland managed for shooting!

[Sam Thompson]

Do you not think that woodland is a better environment for all native species, given that the British Isles has been entirely covered in trees for the majority of its history?

 

Ahh. But we changed and buggered about until we liked it more. Changing back is not really that clever. Things have adapted and changed, as has the way people think (Not that I really care). If we get forests back how do the hill men make a living?

[Perkins]

Ahh. But we changed and buggered about until we liked it more. Changing back is not really that clever. Things have adapted and changed, as has the way people think (Not that I really care). If we get forests back how do the hill men make a living?

 

very true

[Big 'Ammer]

A friend of mine works for a large shooting estate, who own large areas of moorland. They are paid by Natural England in the region of £10,000 per year to maintain this moorland, part of which involves pulling up self-seeded trees, including Holly, Oak and Birch. They have been pulling up thousands of them recently and burning them.

 

My view is that the moorland is simply de-forested land, and obviously would support a massively greater wildlife population than the current green-desert of heather which supports nothing but a few game birds. Especially when there are traps set everywhere to catch so-called vermin like stoats, foxes and weasels.

 

The ecological imbalance is ridiculous. 20,000 pheasants a year are released and then fed grain, while the balooning populations of animals that take advantage of all this meat are controlled using traps, poison and guns.

 

With eco-awareness suposedly at an all time high, I can't believe that a government funded body is paying people to pull up native trees to maintain what is an un-natural eco-system, just to prop up a rich mans business and a rich mans hobby.

 

I'm writing to Natural England to discover the thinking behind this absurd situation.

 

 

Whether the moorland should be left to help itself, or English Nature pay people to carry out their preferred management strategy, is an interesting debate.

 

I would , however, think it extremely unlikely that an Estate releases 20,000 pheasants onto a moor.

 

The Estate probably releases a lot of pheasants, onto the arable and woodland parts of its territory, and they will be managed accordingly.

 

Moorland is the territory of our native Red Grouse.

 

Grouse cannot be artificially reared and released, and so moorland has to be managed and vermin controlled for their benefit.

 

The ecological wider benefits of well managed grouse moors are well documented.

[Sam Thompson]

Just to give my opinion on re-foresting the country; I like the idea. I think it would give us scope to re-introduce things properly - cool things, that eat people (especially rambling bobble hats), and build damns across rivers. But it is impractical. Unless we get rid of all these damn people and their cities.

 

 

But it won't happen. Because no-one wants to live as hunter gatherers and die aged thirty. Apart from me

Edited April 23, 2011 by Sam Thompson

[Charlieh]

was it on moorland or blanket bog? moorland wouldnt be so bad, although a reasonable range of waders utilise this habitat,

 

if its on blanket bog this is a very rare fragile habitat that we have a significant % of the worlds resource of upland blanket bog, which support huge amounts of red data book species including birds, invertebrates, plants, fungi, most upland blanket bog is SSSI/SAC due to the international importance of this land. Its not as clear cut as just pulling trees off a grouse moor.

 

Which area of the country is this in as i may be able to point you to the relevant natural england contact who would be overseeing the agreement carrying out the work, so you can speak to them directly to find out why the work is being carried out

[tommer9]

Not everyone believes that britain WAS 100% forested.....I am not SURE either way, but even Rackham admits that it could be either way.

 

I was in the north york moors area some years ago and the effects of the drainage on the moor for pheasant shoots were being worried about then.

[NI Tree]

just to get you all thinking about grants

 

under the countryside managment sceame farmer can be paid for

set a side

leaving grass maragemens around arrable fields. for native flowers.

 

beetle banks in big arable field to creat a home for bugs when the crops are harvested so they can over winter and reconlised the field quicker when replanted. in fact it is possible to cover you cost from loss of production from the ban as it can reduce pesticide use as you do not have to do as much preventive spraying.