Opinions please on large Beech

[mrtree]

Read your own statement and you can see what the underlying basis is.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Can it??? have reduced huge beech trees 35% and they have still failed so we have gone back cleaned them up reduced another 35% and a year later the trees failed again,have also tried and still trying to manage merrip infected beech some have failed I could think of a lot of trees actually that have failed that I've tried to save so I disagree totally with that statement, yes some trees are needlessly felled...there is probably a 97 % chance stevies tree won't fail but that's still leaving a chance and at the end of the day trees near property pose a risk and it's up to the people who own amd live with them to make up there mind what they want...

 

And theres a chance a a lightning bolt will strike you down tommorow, life is random as is chance, good tree knowledge is not taking a chance it is making a well informed and reasonable descision, REASONABLE.

 

If it is reasonable to fell every psuedo defective tree, then it is also reasonable to ban smoking, the motor vehicle and asking all of humanity to stop living on the flood plains int he valley creases.

 

Steven your photos show a different story than we have been presented with earlier. I still believe the tree could have been saved if the owner wanted.

 

If you read Mattheck's VTA and talk of t/r I am sure you can examine these photos as a learning ecperience. Brian Kane believes that Mattheck's 30% limit for t/r is far too conservative. t/r could be as little as 1% in certain cases.

 

There is no doubt

 

Frank's example of a decayed beech (stump) is a no brainer from his limited description and photos. The tree show extensive decay without a complete nondecayed shell. t/r is between 0 and 20%. We do not know the architecture of the tree so that is no help.

 

If you can put your finger underneath it while the wind blows you have a major problem. Either you mean it is about to topple in the soil or there is a major crack in the stem. Either one likely points to removal.

 

What is the deciding factor for this tree in my opinion is the location. Next to a busy road changes really means the tree will never be vigourous again and will never lay down enough new wood to compensate for the loss of strength. We know that the future is not good for the tree due to decay and stress and as such I would consider removing the tree and using it as an opportunity to plant new trees.

 

Franks tree was a no brainer. looked like resi bracket frank is this right?

 

The last pic is a cracker stevie!

 

I find it odd how something with as many variables as nature, people use such specific percentages, formulas. . .

 

Sweden has opened my eyes to what trees can withstand, blows alot of written 'rules of thumb' and formulas out the window

 

Statistical values do not IMO come anywhere near to being the refined appraoch they claim to be, the VTA method is a great system, others have merely come along to steal the show and accolade, before mattheck there was no such things! NUFF SAID.... for now:001_rolleyes:

 

I agree with you it won't fail, the 3 % is storms! My big beech reduction failures .... Mattheck does not take in to account that no strain of fungus or tree is the same in some cases lignin can be broken down far quicker than others,why is that scare mongering I can't monitor a tree monthly neither can you prevent storms and for the record I have sucsesfully braced and reduced many trees and I believe prevented from failure but people getting sentimental about a tree that should be felled is great.... Even though some should of never been given a chance

 

Claus is (by his own admission) no mycologist, its true, but you are also no mycologist and certainly not up to speed on the work of C. Mattheck.

 

3% is storms? Well what storms? What wind speeds? You clearly know what storm will destroy the tree is you know 3%. Lets hear your specific answer rather than just saying that there will always be a storm that can destroy the tree.

 

The fact is that the storm that will break the stem of this tree, in its current condition will destroy the home next to it. So yes you are fear mongering with the normal tree cutter's histronics of THE STORMS THE STORMS.

 

heck of a lot of it, its not really scare mongering, it is a lack of knowledge generating fear within even arbs. We shouldnt hold it against them, nor blame them thier work based on what they FEEL is right. What we must do instead is ensure that the current generation once retired are no longer making those descisions, and the educated younger generation take over and make a more informed approach to hazard assesment and risk.

[mrtree]

Stephen I reread the initial post and looked at the photos and still do not see cause for alarm. Your longitudinal slab is very interesting and instructive that the decay is not extensive.

[Stephen Blair]

i dont know if you can, i know some guys on here can. But are you able to edit that picture and put arrows and labels on it telling me what is actually going on with the decay.

[Frank]

Franks tree was a no brainer. looked like resi bracket frank is this right?

 

erm....resi bracket??? looks like last years to me??

[mrtree]

I doubt I can pull the picture off and add info but what we know is that the fungi is moving quickly along the lines of least resistantce (essentiially up and down) and then spreading out from the pith across growth rings. We can expect the decay to be stopped in its lateral spread at a wall or layer of metabolites that the tree has laid down to protect itself. Read some of Shigo's CODIT to learn more.

[MattyF]

Hama your right I am no mycologist and I am not making out I am , i very much agreed with your first posts on this thread, and indeed my reading of Mattheck is limited compared to yours probably , but I can't agree that all trees with decay issues can be retained there is to many varying factors to go with it at the end of the day IMO

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

i dont know if you can, i know some guys on here can. But are you able to edit that picture and put arrows and labels on it telling me what is actually going on with the decay.

 

i will deliver later, got a lot of posting to do today:thumbup1:

 

erm....resi bracket??? looks like last years to me??

 

soft or hard? looks resi to me but could be igniarius, same strategy anyways, maybe the resi slightly more aggressive though.

 

I doubt I can pull the picture off and add info but what we know is that the fungi is moving quickly along the lines of least resistantce (essentiially up and down) and then spreading out from the pith across growth rings. We can expect the decay to be stopped in its lateral spread at a wall or layer of metabolites that the tree has laid down to protect itself. Read some of Shigo's CODIT to learn more.

 

I will have a propper look and do the arrows thing as I said later, its hard work in here at times isnt mr tree! stick at it my man, we have to.

[Frank]

@hama. It was hard.

 

Also thought it was Ganoderma:blushing:

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

@hama. It was hard.

 

Also thought it was Ganoderma:blushing:

 

then it was phelinus igniarius, and perenial as apposed to annual in the resinaceum.

 

both intense white rotters