the body language of Decay, The Delights of D

[chris cnc]

thats called a convenient truth chris!

 

Open your mind mr quade

 

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrgggggggghhhhhhhh

[sean freeman]

This is, like a great many threads on Arbtalk (started by hama) wonderfully thought provoking, and that it generates disagreement (differences in opinion) is part of its greatest strength.

 

For me there is a real trap that a huge number of thinkers (be they Arbs/ecologists/mycologists/virologists/sociologists) whatever their chosen label fall into and that is the teleological trap.

 

It is perfectly understandable that we percieve and interpret the world as if other organisms were motivated by the same morass of emotional white noise that seems to drive us....and there are a number of very effective methods to counter that anthropomorphism.

 

Sometimes imbuing other organisms with very 'human' emotions can be illuminating and help refine a particular perspective...sometimes it just obscures things even more.

 

Teleology on the other hand is NOT at all helpful and to me is a kind of apriori reductionism that can stop creative thought in its tracks.

 

For me it is not useful to develop a perspective on the relationship between fungi and tree that requires backwards causation to explain the principle aspects, to have intellectual rigour (to have an arguement/perspective that stands up to examination) if we are to attribute mentalistic mechanisms to organisms like fungi we need to be very precise and clear about our terms....otherwise what might well be a valid point will be lost to the reader/listener.

 

To those (and by the quality of the various discussions here I have the opinion there appear to be quite a few of you) who have read around and talked around these issues, I know there is a substantive and critical difference between the simplifications of teleology and some of the published examinations of the multitude of factors at play influencing a particular 'climatic pulse' expressed in the species and age distribution within a particular community.

 

Anyway for fear of disappearing up my own mental culdesac, reading some of these threads I wish I was nearer to ole blighty...I know I would gain a great deal from spending a day on a tramp with you guys listening to your thoughts about the manifestation of these relationships in some of your fabulous woodland environments.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

I think it unfortunate that we have gone down THIS route of thought again, probaly my own doing though!

 

was never my intention for this subject to get side tracked, I will get things back on track!

 

The whole point and purpose of this was to help others gain from what i have seen out in the field on my many private communions with nature. I am glad that my threads are enjoyable and worthwhile, but i have yet to "perfect" the format or style of my writing and approach to what is a very important science to me.

 

I will keep trying, till it is perfect:001_smile:

 

And then I will write the book!

[sean]

I think it unfortunate that we have gone down THIS route of thought again, probaly my own doing though!

 

was never my intention for this subject to get side tracked, I will get things back on track!

 

The whole point and purpose of this was to help others gain from what i have seen out in the field on my many private communions with nature. I am glad that my threads are enjoyable and worthwhile, but i have yet to "perfect" the format or style of my writing and approach to what is a very important science to me.

 

I will keep trying, till it is perfect:001_smile:

 

And then I will write the book!

 

get on with it man.......hispidus.......discuss

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Hispidus, what do you want to know?

[BatiArb]

Hispidus, what do you want to know?

.

 

Well, how about considering the bad reputation I hispidus has when colonising the ripe wood of mature ash trees.

 

Is this really justified?

 

Yes, its decay strategy in Platanus sp. appears to be more selective and supposedly more predictable, but should we be more concerned about Fraxinus as a result or is it just different and actually not any more of a liability?

.

 

 

 

Fantastic thread Tony - keep it up..... the detours just reflect the complexity of life in our conditioned existence....

 

How far down the rabbit hole do you want to go......?

 

 

 

.

[BatiArb]

Fantastic photograph this one Tony.... I love it :thumbup:

 

 

 

 

Hows this for the ultimate expression of Auricularia mesenterica on beech:001_cool:

 

[ATTACH]51622[/ATTACH]

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Arhgh Mr cowan, im honoured, and glad you like the rather special beech and its associated fungal language!

 

Hispidus on ash isnt half as bad not even 1/5th as bad as we are lead to believe, i have no doubt you know as well as I.

 

Its a difficult thing to chalenge the perceptions with regards decay, ROT has very negative associations in the human physcology, as for the rabbit hole, your one of the few who can add a great deal to this thread, and im glad to see you having a peek!

 

now get your "other" head on and have some fun with us

[Matthew Arnold]

We have an Oak tree on one of the urban sites i manage. It is undermined by those pesky wabbits. It had a grey coloured, knobbly surfaced bracket fungi growing in a dip on one of the butresses. The crown in the summer is very healthy. We will be doin a minor amount of crown lifting with our polesaw. The epicormic growth/ crown lifting limbs are growing in a ring at the same height. I shall get some pictures of the work before and after and its proximity to targets. And will get some pics of the bracket fungi which is now in our office and it had fallen off.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

.

 

Well, how about considering the bad reputation I hispidus has when colonising the ripe wood of mature ash trees.

 

Is this really justified?

 

Yes, its decay strategy in Platanus sp. appears to be more selective and supposedly more predictable, but should we be more concerned about Fraxinus as a result or is it just different and actually not any more of a liability?

.

How far down the rabbit hole do you want to go......?

 

I do think hispidus is worse from a limb failure point of view on ash as apposed to planes, but its certainly not anywhere near the liability that it is billed to be. reduction work that simulates the retrenching relationship eradicates the risks associated, retention of almost full crowns is feasable.