looking at going freelance. advice needed...

[Rich Rule]

Just because your mate didn't have the correct insurance' date=' [b']doesn't make it the fault of the insurance company.[/b]

 

You were working for him, under his direction.

 

He should have had EL cover.

 

That is not what I was implying. The point I have tried to illustrate is the clarity of what actually is a freelance worker compared to a Bonafide subcontractor.

 

I know he should have had EL, I even informed him of the fact as he had the same cover as myself. But to no avail.

 

If he had sent you to do the work without him supervising' date=' you would be a bona-fide sub contractor.

 

As a bona-fide sub contractor, the decision whether to go on the roof or not would have been yours, and therefore the liability for the action would have been yours, not his.[/quote']

 

Yes I know that.

 

In your case' date=' he didn't have the correct, legally required cover, and the cover you held was not relevant to the incident.

 

Good job he is your mate and you didn't take it further.

 

How would you have felt if you had broke your back and could'nt work ever again?[/quote']

 

Exactly. How do you think he would have felt? Pretty bad I can only assume.

 

IME I have not had many dealings with Insurance companies where when the time arrises they haven't tried to squirm out of a payment. I am not refering solely to Arb Ins either. Car, Home and travel have all had similar experiences. Again, it is only my opinion, but Insurance companies are there to make the shareholders money.

 

For what it is worth, I have had PL for a number of years. On renewal I will have to think long and hard as to the path I will follow.

[Mark Bolam]

Total waste of money for you to have your own insurance IMO Rich, the companies you freelance for have EL, job done.

[Mark Bolam]

Jeepster, you would be better off spending the money on some kind of sickness benefit cover, as long as it is one that would actually cough up if you couldn't work for a while.

 

It's not all milk and honey out there mate. There will be plenty of days, in the winter especially, when you earn nothing. Is it not worth having a chat with your current company about a pay rise before you take the plunge?

 

Good luck with it, anyway.

[Frank]

Good for you.

 

Another good exampel of why it is unecessary......

 

Frank, when you work for other companies do you sign thier RA? Or at least read it and agree with it etc. If yes, then you don't need another insurance policy.

 

If you refuse to have anything to do with their RA and write your own everyday and make them all sign yours then you would need to be insured!!

No but one day I could be cutting a hedge on my own. One day I could be splitting logs. One day I could be smashing down a sycamore with my climber mate helping me out. One day I could be dismantling a big beech with a crane for another company. I can't just get single day cover for as and when I need it so I just get job lot.

[Frank]

i feel that may be incorrect frank.

 

If you are classed as a B/F subcontractor then you should have PL.

 

Yeah they need their own PL but a contractor needs EL to subcontract????

 

I think. Haha.

[nailer]

jeepster, good luck first off, but you'll do fine. I reckon Big 'Ammer and Rupe are right about the insurance issue. Personally, I'd recommend you set up as a bone fide sub-contractor. Your climbing skills sound sorted; help your main contractors however you can. In time get good at quoting for them; look out for work from neighbours and deal with it. Keep tabs on their kit and make sure its getting looked after properly and serviced in a timely manner. Take responsibilities away from your boss and help him in every way you can. Post 'before and after' pictures of your reductions on arbtalk and make it clear which areas you cover. Invoice properly and promptly, without ever having to be asked. Charge at least £140.

[Rupe]

i feel that may be incorrect frank.

 

If you are classed as a B/F subcontractor then you should have PL.

 

Yes you should have it, but that does not mean you will have it. Its up to the main contractor to check that you have, and have PL themselves just in case.

[Rupe]

Originally Posted by Big 'Ammer

If he had sent you to do the work without him supervising, you would be a bona-fide sub contractor.

 

No this is wrong but it is where some confusion arises.

 

You don't become a bona fie sub contractor just cos you get sent off to do a job without the boss there! If you get sent with his groundies for example then its is still his job!

 

If he has seen the job (when he quoted) and you ahve not, you are beign sent under instruction, you are NOT a BFSC. His insurance still covers it.

 

BFSC will have visited the jon before hand, given a written quote to the main contractor and then carry out the work usign thier own employees and kit in their own time.

[Rupe]

Franks bit.......

 

To cut a long story short, he called on his PL provider (Trust) and told them what had happened. He used the term that he only uses Bonafide subcontractors and they informed him that he didn't have EL cover... and that he needed to speak to my insurer.

 

This is the problem. He should not have used the term BFSC, as this was incorrect, but the insurance company used this to get out of paying. You were an employee that day, and you should have been covered, no matter what decisions you made.

[arbogrunt]

some good points on this thread again. I've been freelancing for about 10 years now, the way its gone is; PL is down to the company I work for, my own injury cover is down to me.

Now, it just happens I also do one day a week as a contractor for the wildlife trust, so I'm required to have PL.

Lately, due to lack of work, I've been pricing my own work up and have added EL as well. My ass is covered. The added bonus is, I know people who are getting bits of work that are not insured and are getting me in for my climbing....and my insurance (at the right price of course).

However, I've only had 2 days of work a week for the last month....never been this short of week in 16 years!

My advice would be, stick with your employer for the rest of this year and maybe think of freelancing next year if things pick up...as a freelance climber your are expendable by your very nature and the ways things are going at the moment..its not a good time to start up....