Holder or AGT?

[Mr. Ed]

I need help! I need/want a wee tractor to negotiate our quite steep-in-part woods for winching and towing. I only have a modest budget and am generally happy with old scruffy things as long as they work. I’m no mechanic but our neighbourhood is full of good mechanics who can fix anything. I’ve gone all OCD about it and am torturing myself over a 20 year old AGT 835 and a 40 year old Holder A50. Similarish costs ….
I do like the Holder vibe but also know I need to be practical. 
The only thing I know about these things is that I know nothing about these things.  Apart from having a nice old Ford 4000 in the yard I have no practical experience and would very welcome advice from people who actually know. I’ve ransacked these forums quite extensively. 
I suspect either one would be fine - the Holder in question has a front loader which would be great, but will the loader make it more cumbersome in the woods? Take the bucket off I suppose and point the thing in the air? Also the Holder has a cab which is nice in the rain but I’m a big chap and it looks like it might be awkward to get in out of. 
 

[openspaceman]

We don't have very steep ground in Surrey but I used my two A55 Holders for early thinnings and loved them but be aware a rigid machine with 4 wheel steering is more stable on a slope.

 

The one I had hydratongs on was particularly useful for bunching up loads before the long haul out but in those days we had premium markets for Post, Stake and Rail material and I think this PSR market has gone so thinning for chip or pulp wouldn't pay for these small trees. Having said that it would pull .5m3 poles if necessary. Though you risked breaking an ankle if you had both difflocks in it would waddle out of soft ground.

 

Where are you?

[Mr. Ed]

Thanks OSM. I’m in County Kerry as it happens. Very few such machines in the country let alone the county …

Rigid with 4 wheel steering? You mean as opposed to articulating? 

Edited January 21 by Mr. Ed

[openspaceman]

1 hour ago, Mr. Ed said:

Thanks OSM. I’m in County Kerry as it happens. Very few such machines in the country let alone the county …

Rigid with 4 wheel steering? You mean as opposed to articulating? 

Shame as I got one going for a friend to use on a job which didn't come off.

 

Yes, if you inadvertently turn forward down hill the centre of gravity moves downhill too and as there is more weight at the front it moves forward too, so the back uphill wheel loses weight. In the worst case the CoG moves downhill of the line between the front and back wheels and can turn over. In practice i is not a problem because you can normally avoid such a turn with a bit of shunting. The only time I had a near accident was when I had a load behind that pushed the back round .

Edited January 21 by openspaceman
typo

[Mr. Ed]

Understood about the centre of gravity. I’m reconciled to buying one in the UK or Europe-land. I work in the UK most of the time - Am here now for instance. 

[Stere]

Can you still get the parts for them?

[Mr. Ed]

The Holders? Apparently yes - the earlier ones can be problematic apparently. But you always can get until suddenly you can’t. They’re supposed to be very robust, although I’ve seen several distressed messages on Arbtalk about finding clutches. 

[openspaceman]

41 minutes ago, Stere said:

Can you still get the parts for them?

I don't know, Lamberhurst Equipment used to be good for them.

[Mr. Ed]

I was assuming I'd go straight to Germany to be honest. After the events of recent years, Ireland is learning the joys of auto-translate and buying a lot of stuff from the continong rather than the UK. There's a sizeable community of Holderphiles in Germany and Kärcher, who now own the remains of Holder, have a spare parts service.

[MattyF]

If you can get spares then holder , but like you I’ve seen numerous posts on here and Facebook with folk unable to source clutches. 
I like my agt with wide wheels but the clearance isn’t great for working in the woods , especially if some one else has left numerous 1ft high stumps for you to find and get hung up on.. easy to get parts for and work on though.