What is problem here??

[john87]

1 minute ago, Doug Tait said:

When you say worst that could happen... I was thinking that's probably the more acceptable possible outcome. How about if the compromised tree fails while you have rope/lanyard attached. 

 

I remember a thread here suggesting everything from breakaway attachments between harness and lanyard, to using no stopper knot.

 

Your keen John but I think the best advice you've had is you would benefit most from watching someone else do it.

The leaner from your other thread (Birch isn't it?) sounds like a big step as it is. 

Yes, i was thinking about what happens if you are tied into a tree or a section of a tree that then fails, that would be worse than falling out of the thing by a long way...

 

I think a lot about what i do, overthink it some may say, but if your life depends on it, a bit of thinking in advance is the way to go about it, as it what "could" go wrong, and it it did, what would the result be.. In engineering it is called FMEA "failure mode effect analysis"

 

Have not done the birch yet. Had covid then it rained rather a lot, that sort of put a stop to things, but back to normal soon!!

 

john..

[drinksloe]

I'm generally not someone who's always telling folk to get tickets, but in ur case i do really think u should be doing some sort of climbing training.

 

Have u any chainsaw tickets??

 

If the majority of ur trees are near buildings and assuming they need climbed u obviously have targets near by u don't want to be dropping branches/tops on, getting ur basic tickets should be a must, surprised most folk allow u to do the work without asking for tickets.

The basic tickets probably wouldn't answer this question as how safe a dead/rotten/diseased tree is is an experience thing, and better to learn fron othrs experiences than ur own if it goes wrong.

Ecven felling these dead/diseased trees from the deck can tell u a lot as some species will just crumble/explode /shatter when they hit the deck, i certainly wouldn't like to be up 1 taking bits off

If something goes wrong how would ur insurance cover u?

Most insurances want/expect u to be trained and certified to atleast the basic level

 

But atleast it would give u a genral idea about safe methods of work etc,

I dunno if u have worked with throwlines at all? But if u wanted ur line up the 2nd tree in this instance u could probably do it all from the deck with a throwline and no need to climb it.

 

When i done my training they had just outlawed screw gate carbs for the triple lock 1's and i'm pretty sure ascenders/descenders were fairly new, i wouldn't have a scooby how to use them, definately never shown in the course all those years ago

i think ur over complicating things, not a good thing if u are not 100% on the basics .

 

Also be wary of tieing/climbing on the Blake's hitch, i used to climb on 1 and really liked it, but i also remember if u tie it slightly wrong its called a suicide knot, it looks just like a blakes and even acts like 1 until it just lets go. Been that long since i tied a Blake's i've gave up using them incase i get tie wrong. Can't remember which way it is now but tail either goes in front or behind but only 1 way works, so i thought why risk it when other methods work just fine

Must admit i'm back to a prussick now which does fine for the little climbing i do nowadays

[Haironyourchest]

3 hours ago, drinksloe said:

I'm generally not someone who's always telling folk to get tickets, but in ur case i do really think u should be doing some sort of climbing training.

 

Have u any chainsaw tickets??

 

If the majority of ur trees are near buildings and assuming they need climbed u obviously have targets near by u don't want to be dropping branches/tops on, getting ur basic tickets should be a must, surprised most folk allow u to do the work without asking for tickets.

The basic tickets probably wouldn't answer this question as how safe a dead/rotten/diseased tree is is an experience thing, and better to learn fron othrs experiences than ur own if it goes wrong.

Ecven felling these dead/diseased trees from the deck can tell u a lot as some species will just crumble/explode /shatter when they hit the deck, i certainly wouldn't like to be up 1 taking bits off

If something goes wrong how would ur insurance cover u?

Most insurances want/expect u to be trained and certified to atleast the basic level

 

But atleast it would give u a genral idea about safe methods of work etc,

I dunno if u have worked with throwlines at all? But if u wanted ur line up the 2nd tree in this instance u could probably do it all from the deck with a throwline and no need to climb it.

 

When i done my training they had just outlawed screw gate carbs for the triple lock 1's and i'm pretty sure ascenders/descenders were fairly new, i wouldn't have a scooby how to use them, definately never shown in the course all those years ago

i think ur over complicating things, not a good thing if u are not 100% on the basics .

 

Also be wary of tieing/climbing on the Blake's hitch, i used to climb on 1 and really liked it, but i also remember if u tie it slightly wrong its called a suicide knot, it looks just like a blakes and even acts like 1 until it just lets go. Been that long since i tied a Blake's i've gave up using them incase i get tie wrong. Can't remember which way it is now but tail either goes in front or behind but only 1 way works, so i thought why risk it when other methods work just fine

Must admit i'm back to a prussick now which does fine for the little climbing i do nowadays

Try a distal hitch. Also easy to tie and a bit more forgiving than a prussic. 

[john87]

5 hours ago, drinksloe said:

I'm generally not someone who's always telling folk to get tickets, but in ur case i do really think u should be doing some sort of climbing training.

 

Have u any chainsaw tickets??

 

If the majority of ur trees are near buildings and assuming they need climbed u obviously have targets near by u don't want to be dropping branches/tops on, getting ur basic tickets should be a must, surprised most folk allow u to do the work without asking for tickets.

The basic tickets probably wouldn't answer this question as how safe a dead/rotten/diseased tree is is an experience thing, and better to learn fron othrs experiences than ur own if it goes wrong.

Ecven felling these dead/diseased trees from the deck can tell u a lot as some species will just crumble/explode /shatter when they hit the deck, i certainly wouldn't like to be up 1 taking bits off

If something goes wrong how would ur insurance cover u?

Most insurances want/expect u to be trained and certified to atleast the basic level

 

But atleast it would give u a genral idea about safe methods of work etc,

I dunno if u have worked with throwlines at all? But if u wanted ur line up the 2nd tree in this instance u could probably do it all from the deck with a throwline and no need to climb it.

 

When i done my training they had just outlawed screw gate carbs for the triple lock 1's and i'm pretty sure ascenders/descenders were fairly new, i wouldn't have a scooby how to use them, definately never shown in the course all those years ago

i think ur over complicating things, not a good thing if u are not 100% on the basics .

 

Also be wary of tieing/climbing on the Blake's hitch, i used to climb on 1 and really liked it, but i also remember if u tie it slightly wrong its called a suicide knot, it looks just like a blakes and even acts like 1 until it just lets go. Been that long since i tied a Blake's i've gave up using them incase i get tie wrong. Can't remember which way it is now but tail either goes in front or behind but only 1 way works, so i thought why risk it when other methods work just fine

Must admit i'm back to a prussick now which does fine for the little climbing i do nowadays

Hi There,

I have to be fair, that is one of the most constructive posts i have ever read, so i will answer all your points one at a time..

 

I'm generally not someone who's always telling folk to get tickets, but in ur case i do really think u should be doing some sort of climbing training.

 

Yes, it would be a good idea, but i have no ambition, that is entirely the wrong word, but what i mean is, i am not setting out to set up as an arb expert or a tree work business or anything like that.

I do what i do as a favour if you like, looking after a large estate that would otherwise just be left to go to rack and ruin.

 

I do not get paid at all, indeed, it costs me a lot of money as you can imagine, but i get a LOT of satisfaction out of it and the occupier of the land does quite well out of it too. I know in theory i could fall out of a tree or whatever, but as with other hobbies, i could also fall off my motorbike, electrocute myself, or fall off my scaffolding etc..

 

Have u any chainsaw tickets??

 

No, i did have training though, was a very long time ago. I worked on a farm for a bit. One day i was standing there with the farm owner and a car pulls up. It was the HSE people. They asked if we had any chainsaws. When we said yes, they asked did we want any training. We said might as well, and we had an instant training session there and then. We are both still alive, using saws, and uninjured, so we must have learnt something!! All the saw maintenance i do myself, so my saws [i have three] are BEAUTIFUL.. I know it is different if you do it every day as a job, you cannot spend half the time faffing with your saws, but i have all the time in the world, so makes no difference to me.

 

If the majority of ur trees are near buildings and assuming they need climbed u obviously have targets near by u don't want to be dropping branches/tops on, getting ur basic tickets should be a must, surprised most folk allow u to do the work without asking for tickets.

 

As i said, i do it as a hobby..

 

The basic tickets probably wouldn't answer this question as how safe a dead/rotten/diseased tree is is an experience thing, and better to learn fron othrs experiences than ur own if it goes wrong.

 

Very true!!

 

Even felling these dead/diseased trees from the deck can tell u a lot as some species will just crumble/explode /shatter when they hit the deck, i certainly wouldn't like to be up 1 taking bits off

 

Me neither!!

 

If something goes wrong how would ur insurance cover u?

Most insurances want/expect u to be trained and certified to atleast the basic level

 

I took out insurance obviously. It was not that straighforward though, as it is a bit unusual for someone wanting what amounts to business insurance, not to be running a business, but it was all sorted out and i have 5 million pound public liability cover..

 

But atleast it would give u a genral idea about safe methods of work etc,

I dunno if u have worked with throwlines at all? But if u wanted ur line up the 2nd tree in this instance u could probably do it all from the deck with a throwline and no need to climb it.

 

Yes, i use my throwline a lot. I have one of them "big shot" things. God knows how people use then without the trigger attachment, but with that you can get the throwline where you want it quite accurately with a bit of practice..

 

Lesson number one of throwlines and big shot catapults... When you miss and the thing goes sailing up through the tree, before you pull it back for another go, let it come back to the ground and take the bag off before you pull the line back. Otherwise, when you pull it back and the bag gets stuck you will have to climb the tree to get your bag back.. Guess how i discovered that!!!!

 

When i done my training they had just outlawed screw gate carbs for the triple lock 1's and i'm pretty sure ascenders/descenders were fairly new, i wouldn't have a scooby how to use them, definately never shown in the course all those years ago

i think ur over complicating things, not a good thing if u are not 100% on the basics .

 

Yep, i do not care for gadgets either, that is why i use a Blakes hitch when going up, [If i can with my most excellent Harken Ninja ascender] and when coming down a figure eight under it and the blakes as backup, nothing else..

 

Also be wary of tieing/climbing on the Blake's hitch, i used to climb on 1 and really liked it, but i also remember if u tie it slightly wrong its called a suicide knot, it looks just like a blakes and even acts like 1 until it just lets go. Been that long since i tied a Blake's i've gave up using them incase i get tie wrong. Can't remember which way it is now but tail either goes in front or behind but only 1 way works, so i thought why risk it when other methods work just fine

 

I know what you mean, the tail goes in front of the tail and then behind the climbing rope [aasuming you wind it round anticlockwise that is] Apparently it is not unheard of for people to have the tail behind the tail as it were and then wonder why the knot does not work. I tie a stopper knot after it too. I have not had one try to pull through at all, but a stopper knot is good practice therefore i use one..

 

Must admit i'm back to a prussick now which does fine for the little climbing i do nowadays

 

If i spike up a tree, i drag my climbing rope behind me with it attached to the harness [about 8 feet down the rope] with a prusik and a karabiner about 8 feet down from the end of the rope . Once where i want to be, i just throw the short bit end of the rope round the tree, attach the end to the harness and instant lanyard or set it up with my adjustable friction saver round the stem ready for when i want to come down..

 

john..

 

 

[john87]

2 hours ago, Haironyourchest said:

Try a distal hitch. Also easy to tie and a bit more forgiving than a prussic. 

Hi There,

What do you mean by more forgiving?? I do not understand..

 

john..

[Haironyourchest]

2 hours ago, john87 said:

Hi There,

What do you mean by more forgiving?? I do not understand..

 

john..

They grab the rope less hard than a prussic. Better feedback. Advance easier than a prussic as well, and can be advanced one handed with a micro pulley. Somewhere between an English 4 wrap prussic and a valdotan tress, or so I'm led to believe. 

[drinksloe]

I would ask advice from a better climber than me, but it just seems quite confusing to me mixing up ascenders/descenders and Fo8's combined with friction hitches,unless ur switching from DRT to SRT.

I imagine u'd be better just sticking with a friction hitch to go up and down on

 

Even using cabimum savers, apart from on my course i don't think i've evr seen 1 used or know anyone who has used 1.

I know it will be best practice if doing a lot of moving about tina tree doing reductions etc, but most of my cli,bing was on railways 20 odd year ago so every tree was spiked up and 1 side butchered of it the quickest way possible. Know a few lads doing power line clearance and there much the same to be honest

 

Just keep it simple.

For a hobby limber that doesnt like gimmicks u do seem to have quite a few

 

I'd double check ur insurance but i doubt it will cover u if something goes wrong and u put a branch throu a buildings roof as ur not trained.

 

So i take it u free spike up into the tree before tying in??

Ur body/life but really  ur just asking for trouble, only takes 1 slip, broken branch and ur decking out.

 

Everyones different but u wouldn't catch me climbing trees now even if someone was paying me, bugger doing it for nowt.

I do a few for myself now but only cos i grudge paying someone else, and to be fair the last few have been very tricky to close to power lines, most companies would walk away or charge a fortune

[john87]

36 minutes ago, Haironyourchest said:

They grab the rope less hard than a prussic. Better feedback. Advance easier than a prussic as well, and can be advanced one handed with a micro pulley. Somewhere between an English 4 wrap prussic and a valdotan tress, or so I'm led to believe. 

Oh i see!! I will give that a try, see how i get on with it..

 

john..

[john87]

3 hours ago, drinksloe said:

I would ask advice from a better climber than me, but it just seems quite confusing to me mixing up ascenders/descenders and Fo8's combined with friction hitches,unless ur switching from DRT to SRT.

I imagine u'd be better just sticking with a friction hitch to go up and down on

 

Even using cabimum savers, apart from on my course i don't think i've evr seen 1 used or know anyone who has used 1.

I know it will be best practice if doing a lot of moving about tina tree doing reductions etc, but most of my cli,bing was on railways 20 odd year ago so every tree was spiked up and 1 side butchered of it the quickest way possible. Know a few lads doing power line clearance and there much the same to be honest

 

Just keep it simple.

For a hobby limber that doesnt like gimmicks u do seem to have quite a few

 

I'd double check ur insurance but i doubt it will cover u if something goes wrong and u put a branch throu a buildings roof as ur not trained.

 

So i take it u free spike up into the tree before tying in??

Ur body/life but really  ur just asking for trouble, only takes 1 slip, broken branch and ur decking out.

 

Everyones different but u wouldn't catch me climbing trees now even if someone was paying me, bugger doing it for nowt.

I do a few for myself now but only cos i grudge paying someone else, and to be fair the last few have been very tricky to close to power lines, most companies would walk away or charge a fortune

Noooo.. If i spike up a tree i will have my flip line and a lanyard too. I pull up the rope so that i can use it as a super long lanyard if i want, or use it to climb to other bits of the tree. I always come down on the rope as it is lots easier than spiking down!!

 

john..

[carlos]

seems a bit strange to spend all that money on gear and insurance but none on training?

and for some free firewood!! 

is the insurance even valid with no tickets?