Andy Clark

Blimey, you're right, that WAS a pesemistic view. Luckily for me then, that I appear to have had more succesfull and positive experience at this matter than you have had. Firstly, remember that a TPO actually relates to the land that the tree is situated on. Secondly, remember that this is not about breech of TPO, it is about breach of planning permission. The development must (assuming that the LPA have their fingers on the pulse, and have highlighted so in their consent notice) be carried out in accordance with 5837....... if it isn't then THAT is breach of planning regs, and there in itself is a case to answer...... Whether the tree dies/suffers/declines is neither here nor there at this time, as the current action is purely to avoid any comeback on the prospective buyer in years to come, ie bring the contractor to bear NOW, rather than wait for the tree to curl its toes, and then be left with a hefty bill trying to prove that the tree died as a result of past damage. If the council choose not to proceed, then that's down to them..... BUT, the prospective homeowner will be covered. And that, i thought, was the whole purpose of this thread???

There seem to ba a lot of answers jumping all over the place here, so let me clean things up a bit....... You mentioned that the tree is subject to a TPO. With that being the case, the answer is simple......... either you or the prospective buyer report the developer to the LA for breech of TPO NOW!! That way, it remains as it should be, ie a matter for the developer to sort out, after all, he is the one who has breeched the planning conditions. I bet you a pound to a penny, that when planning permission was first sought for the development, the LPA WILL have stated that the development in relation to protected trees, is carried out in acordance with BS 5837....... if the developer has not done that, then he is in breach of the planning conditions and should be the one to carry the can for that. SIMPLES! The developer will undoubtedly be issued a fine, plus more importantly, the LPA will more than likely require that the developer make good the damage, which may (if the damage is THAT bad) result in fell and re-plant at the developers expense. More often than not (as Arborist sites mentions) trying to sort stuff like this out after the build has finished and the sale completed, is nigh on impossible. After all, "willfull damage", is going to be pretty hard to prove once the overspill has been removed and the ground around the tree re-instated with nice new turf and flower borders. Not only that, but the costs for finding such "proof" in years to come, ie re-excavating the RPA to look for damage, will more than likely be on the head of the prospective buyer.

AWESOME, another opening for a de-rail....... So, industry politics...... what do we all think???

Yep, and you can be chief "student groundie ar5e kicker"...... When you've done that and got them all working like dogs, you can run through the method statement and risk assessment with them, making sure that all thoroughly understand the associated hazards on site, and then get them to sign on the appropriate doted line. (How's that D? Steered back on track..... ish!)

Guess i'd better get me climbing kit outta mothballs then.

Is it something like this........ Mar-Bar Ascending Sys : SherrillTree Tree Care Equipment

We seem to have diverted onto a bit of a mapping software tangent...... I'm looking for more of a dedicated management database like ezytreev or arbortrack..... i didn't think the GIS stuff covered that aspect??

I must admit that the "free" bit was what attracted me the most. That, plus the fact that it allegedly has a worldwide user listing. At the mo, i'm trying to find something that's cost effective and will collaborate on a much wider scale, rather than paying extortionate software costs and licenced user rates for something that is pretty much UK specific. Any suggestions Chris??

Unfortunately not Andy, it's a tree management sofware package, similar to ARBORtrack or EzyTreev. i-Tree Tools for Assessing and Managing Community Forests It's devolped in the US, but lists 70 UK users....... keen to find out who they are and how they get on with it.

Just out of curiosity.... Recently downloaded the i-Tree software, and wondered if anyone else was using it? I'm keen to get anyone elses feedback or views on how they have got on with it. Cheers

No, it's still and always up to him. Contract of employment is "normally" written from the perspective of what "YOU" do within your employment, and very rarely mentions what "your employer" will do. That would normally come down to the staff handbook. If you are en employee, he buys your PPE! Pure and simple, end of, full stop, capital letter.

Of course, the other point to consider, is the matter of insurance. aleach, do you have you're own insurance, or do you work under your boss's Employers liability insurance?? Chances are, if it's the latter, his E/L won't cover you to climb in your own kit!

What do you mean "doesn't state"? Sorry mate, i don't really understand the question.

16 years on the tools as both a subby and direct empolyee climber..... for 2/3 man bands, right up to big international sized companies........ then on to college lecturing, then on to contract management, employing some of the biggest contracting companies in the UK industry... so as far as experience goes, i've had to cover and deal with both sides of the coin. But taking it a step further as a contract manager that has employed companies, i know the tricks and loop-holes that companies TRY and exploit...... even had to repremand an AAAC once upon a time, for pulling a similar trick with regards to staff training.

Why your employment status is important Each type of employment status has different legal rights, so it is important to know which category you fall into. Your employment status will determine your rights at work. Employment status is different from your working pattern. So as well as an 'employee' or 'worker' your working arrangement might be described in one or more of the following terms. part-time fixed-term contractor consultant casual zero hours seasonal agency or 'temp' office holder volunteer Various factors will determine your employment status. For example, just because you have a contract that describes you as an 'employee' or as 'self-employed' does not mean that it is the case. If you are unsure about your employment status, read the other articles in this section. They outline some of the points that help determine employment status and include example situations to help you decide if they apply to you. Agency workers Casual or irregular work Employees Office holders Independent contractors or consultants Personal service consultants Seasonal or fixed-term contracts Volunteers Employment Tribunal decisions on your employment status Ultimately only a court or Employment Tribunal can make a final decision on your employment status. They will base their decision on a number of different factors, which are in line with legal tests developed through case law. An Employment Tribunal will look at how an employment relationship works in practice to determine your employment status. They will look at whether: you have to take on the work personally, rather than sending a substitute or sub-contracting the work your work provider has a significant degree of control, or right of control, over you you are paid a regular salary your employer or work provider deducts tax and National Insurance (rather than you being responsible for making these payments) you receive holiday pay, sick pay, maternity pay etc you work at your employer's premises and use your employer's tools and/or facilities you are integrated into the business (for example, if you appear in the company organisational chart, are subject to the company's disciplinary and grievance procedures) you have any financial risk or reward, for example bonuses depending on how quickly or well the work is performed you work exclusively for one business rather than performing work for a number of 'customers' you have an employment contract or any other contractual documentation, eg a letter of appointment, which describes you as an employee (also know as a statement of mutual intention) Normally if you are self-employed for tax purposes, you will be self-employed in relation to your employment rights. However, if you are self-employed for tax purposes it will not prevent an Employment Tribunal from finding that you are an 'employee' or a 'worker' for employment law purposes. HMRC's decisions are not binding on Employment Tribunals.

Course he is!! The boss should be providing safe and legaly compliant kit kit, and not putting him in the position that he has to buy his own! At the end of the day, it's shortcuts like this, that are the reason he can afford a DB9.

O.k, got a few differnces of opinion to my views.... which is fair enough..... But look at it this way...... yeah, the boss might get the hump and give the him the boot..... but would you REALLY want to work for someone that put your safety on the line at such a whim??? I know damn well that i wouldn't!!

Makes no difference mate..... none at all!!! The legal precedence relates to the premise of continual employment, not how your wages/tax are payed. If you work solely for him, then you are classed as an employee, and the same rules apply....... If you're a "subby climber" and work for numerous different companies, then and ONLY then is it down to you.

Yeah, but you lot seem to forget that the law is on your side!!! If you're an employee, and he gives you the boot for making him acknowledge his legal obligation, then fine.... take him to a tribunal and sue the pants of him!!! Belive me, you'll win!!

I've been reading this thread with my jaw wide open in utter disbelief!!!! aleach, you're making it sound like your boss is doing you some kind of "Favour" by giving you kit and paying for your training..... HE'S NOT!!!! As an employer, he not only has the "duty of care" mentioned earlier, but in fact has a LEGAL OBLIGATION to provide you with training and fit for purpose equipment. Furthermore, he's actually breaking the law by making you pay him back!!! If i were you, i'd downlad a copy of the PUWER regs and wave that under his nose, whilst pointing out that you require a new climbing kit. It constantly amazes me how employers like this get away with it. SHOCKING!!!! :thumbdown:

I think you've hit the nail on the head there chap. With the best will in the world, at the end of the day and when all is said and done, tickets/training are NEVER going to prepare you for that real life situatuion of when it REALLY matters........ that time when the adrenaline kicks in, and you know that it's down to you to save that blokes life. Belive me, I KNOW!! Had a chap cut his wrist open with an 020 about 9 years ago now. We were both climbing up two different trees, re-pollarding a load of willows along a river bank, about 5 mins walk from the truck. I'd just got down from mine and was clearing up on the ground around the base when i heard him shout. Looked up and he was clutching his left wrist with his right hand.... claret running through his fingers and down his arm..... It's THAT moment, that's the one that counts...... that split second decision of "Erm... what do i do now?" Scariest situation i've ever been in! Cried like a baby as the ambulance pulled away and the adrenaline subsided. Not something I ever wanna go through again!

Anyway.... jobs all done, logs have all gone...... THANK GOD!!!! Just wanted to thank one and all who have popped in over the past few days for their share. Gawd bless ya! Very VERY appreciated!

Heath Mount Prep School..... on the A602 between Watton-at-Stone and Ware.

Not at all mate, you ain't putting anyones back up........ The long and short of it, is that he had a bloke lined up to take it, but the bloke let him down on Monday morning. Day 1 of the job!!...... Which, when you're back's up against the wall trying to make sure the job was done in the school half-term time frame we had, kinda put the kybosh on the job. I mean, it's not like he coulda turned round and added another couple of days to the job or the price........ the quote said to take it away, so we had to get rid! Pure and simple. Like i said in the opening post, my mate doesn't bother with firewood or anything, so had no interest in the timber at all....... hence me posting to see if anyone else could make use of it. I think Huck got it about right...... about not relying on "Firewood warriors". That's the mistake my mate made, but i doubt it's be one he'll be making again.

Well, it's down and we've begun the daunting task of ringing it up........