sean freeman

Great thread guys and gals..thumbs up (or should that be down???) from down under

Just for your interest (hopefully) the typical painstripper like form of the stocking from Phellinus noxius. Growing in the base of a Viburnum odoratissimum (an environmental weed down here, though of course P.n is not so selective) Last shot is the Blue Peter moment....'one I prepared earlier' old stocking on long dead tree marking the gradual spread of P.n across the yard.

Aha Robinia, false acacia yes makes sense the fruit are right and it was a very popular tree in the 80-90's here. Bit of a colonial boy David, dad in the Army...born in Malaya moved back to UK 1974, spent time in Southern Africa 1984/5 arrived Oz 1988, lived in North Queensland since then but the lack of work for an Arb consultant (which is what I increasingly 'became' around 2006) led me to my current insane travelling yoyo existance. Have attached a shot of the fruit/seeds to confirm your ID.... Also below is a lovely fruiting body (I know should be in the other thread sorry I'm being lazy ) not confident about the ID for that either

Admittedly more a case of meristematic madness, but intriguing neverthless...sorry don't know the species took the shots on a rare trip to our capital city Canberra for an Urban Planning Conference...my excuse is that they grow some trees there that I have not seen I was a teenager in the Midlands and North Derbyshire....a time when my focus tended to be more Real Ale based:laugh1:

Well jealous:hmpf:..Spain is just too far...So much to spend so little money on.....maybe when there is a conference/workshop run in the southern hemisphere...maybe we should be planning on running that ourselves. Even if I could afford it I spend so much time in the air as it is my carbon footprint is getting well out of hand:shot: It'll have to be yet another begging letter to Ted, Neville Jill David et al...suspect they are getting well tired of those sad missives by now.

What an impressive tree David, have you contacted the Ancient Yew Group? taxus baccata, The Ancient Yew Tree You probably have, I am confident they would help you do everything practical to help keep the tree in place for as long as possible.

I'm sorry I don't know, I never saw the results of the pull test that was carried out in 2008. I would expect that any physical testing would have to emphasize caveats and limitations which for a tree in the condition of this one (even in 2008) there would have been a mountain of..... From my reading of events viewed from Australia the pull test was carried out to dispute the assertion that the tree was unacceptably weakened in 2008, I think the timeline is still on the campaign web site...sadly the reports appear to be no longer available, the website has changed quite a lot.

It was apparently welded not bolted based on info from Wolter Kok who works in the Netherlands http://www.treespotter.nl/ I suspect that to really get reliable info you might have to try and contact someone who worked on the tree. You could try Nicolaas Verloop at Pius Floris, but I suspect they have everyday matters of making ends meet and dealing with inquiring Arbs from other countries might be low on their radar.

I fear that you may be right. Yes, but it would seem they managed to secure it to the point where the 'welds' failed rather than the piles being pulled out. I feel for the chap who made those welds they will be copping some flak I suspect.

A couple of points here; I'm not sure that an Arborist would have been called upon to design the suport frame, sure they would have been invovled in working out aspects of its connection to the tree and protection of soil and roots where the piles were driven in. I'm fairly sure that those who were asked to provide expert opinion would have been clear about what could be observed and assessed regarding the degree of dysfunction at the time of the assessment. Just how any potential liability (repair costs for the walls etc) plays out will I suspect have more to do with the Dutch legal system than any lay view (mine included) of who should be 'responsible'. I know we can as a profession be a bit precious about how we are percieved by other professions we interact with, engineers, ecologists, botanists, barristers etc... Personally I try hard to take other professionals as I find them and hope they do me the same courtesy...not denying that the way evens like this get reported can have a very negative impact in many ways...and that can be difficult to deal with at the coal face.

Well perhaps, certainly if a barrister has reservations about a certain position being posited by a professional consultant they might try and associate examples (of what they believe to be evidence) of such professional opinion not being supported by later events. But this is always likely in court, how convincing expert witness evidence is does often rest on how they present themselves in a specific case with specific issues....tort law (at least in the UK and Australia) tends to (IMO) have a major influence on how judgements are finally reached.

Just a quick update regarding the failure of the support frame. Apparently this frame was not bolted to the screw piles but rather welded to them and it seem from what can be seen in the pics that those welds (if they were actually effective welds) failed completely. The frame consequently did not perform according to its design intent. I expect that those who provided documentation to the courts were careful to be precise about the limitations to be applied to their opinions regarding the future stability of the tree.

Your are quite right David, for very obvious reasons there was a great deal of emotion tied up in the tissues of this particular tree....and I certainly was a vocal supporter for its retention from the distant shores of Australia. I wasn't trying to drive the conversation anywhere I just know how this will be presented by some over here, and suspect similar monochromatic interpretations might play out over there. I am genuinely sad that it failed but glad noone was hurt in the process.

I know that it was reported that a number of seedlings were planted in other parks across the city (Amsterdam) and that seeds were sent to many different locations in the world. You are right Neville will be saddened by this, his support and the second opinion he provided was important in getting the felling order lifted almost three years ago now. I just hope that this failure in a very significantly compromised tree does not prejudice future efforts to retain other older trees in European cities.

I was saddened to read about the total failure (through the lower stem) of the Anne Frank Tree last night in Amsterdam:thumbdown:. It is especially disappointing given all the effort that a great many people went to in order to have the tree retained. There was never any doubt of the ultimate fate of the tree given the extent of the decay, the prolonged poor health of the tree and the extent of past damage to its root system...however I had personally hoped that the frame that had been designed for it would have held the tree upright for a little longer than turned out to be the case. No shortage of pictures, even video on the net of the failed tree and its fractured stem. Some from local news here: Anne Frankboom - AT5 Nieuws I am confused about the steel tripod structure toppling over like that since the engineering drawings I saw seemed to indicate micro piles holding it in place...no sign of them though:sneaky2:. The weather does not seem to have been terrible some wind is reported but nothing more significant.

A lovely looking tree, whats the target under it?

As usual Andrew a really thoughtful article well written and enjoyable to read...sounds like you had a great time recharging your batteries. Thankyou for sharing it.

Thankyou for posting the excerpt.

As promised a few fungi pics to make up for all that text and tribulations..... Rutstroemia sp (Orange cup fungi) Cymatoderma elegans var. lamellatum showy fella, my pics don't do it justice. Its been raining in SE Qld whilst I've been up north, so looking forward to a few walks amongst the FB's when I get back on monday

Great thought provoking piece of writing, impressive man, I share all those sentiments in my work as an Arborist...thankyou for posting it.

Hi Tim, I quite agree, sadly there are some hefty bits of planning policy that have already led to some very very serious disasters here...The SEQ Regional Plan tell us we are going to have the Chinese army arrive in the next 10yrs and so it seems we have to irradicate some of the most vulnerable vegetative communities and all of its associated fauna to build new towns etc... I am a passionate Arborist who along with a range of other professionals is increasingly concerned by the failure to adopt worlds best practice in either assessment or implementation. We have some of the best sounding policy statements and desired outcomes imaginable. I note that the credit cunch in the UK seems to have halted a few high profile development projects that were threatening areas of Ancient Woodland, but I accept budget cuts generally will hit the non-essential green infrastructure long before the steel and concrete projects are reconsidered. I am worried that the very impressive plans for sustainable green space development within the London 2012 olympic projects will be very seriously downsized or even shelved completely. I think the best approach as a consulting Arborist (with my obvious focus on older significant trees) is to build more and more relationships with allied professionals, ecologists, landscape architects (yes I know, I know), engineers, council officers. There is a real danger in feeling isolated and that noone else or no other profession shares our own concerns our own understanding....and whilst it is true we bring something a bit unique to the project table...I am continually surprised by the similarities in frustrations being felt by others. Protection and conservation of valuable ecological communities does not preclude development...it just requires a commitment to not only recognise the value of increasingly rare habitats (Standing large diameter deadwood for example) but to adapt development plans to accomodate, retain and protect that habitat. Cryptogams are amazingly resiliant...PROVIDED THEIR HABITAT REMAINS...David's experience on HH supports that perspective. I'll dig out some nice fungi pics to make up for all my text....

Thanks david, your years of work on Hampstead are an inspiration mate. If and when you meet Cassian I'm sure he will provide you with his take on the task we face here....no red lists (nor anything equivalent!) no national legislation at all that even recognises the critical importance of cryptogams (algae, lichens, mosses, liverworts and fungi). Very very little recognition at state level (Victoria has one fungi on its endangered list!!!!!) As a continent we have only formally described 5% of the estimated total number of fungi species named to species level!!!!!! This is despite the Eucalypt systems in southern Australia being considered a global diversity hotspot for hypogeneous fungi. There is a real concern that by the time wee begin to understand what there is here it will be too late. The mentality here tends to be that the continent is soooo large that there is plenty of habitat refuge elsewhere....the simplistic banality of this position seems to escape the majority of those who want increased intensive urban development. The continent is very very large but sadly (for biodiversity and the environmental future of many many organisms) the specific ecological communities that are so critical are restricted to the very same narrow strip of land between the ranges and the coast that we are so attracted to....funny that eh??? Rant over.

Earliella scabrosa (syn Trametes scabrosa/Daedalea emodensis) on Ficus microcarpa var hilli logs Old Botanic Gardens Brisbane. The increasing use of logs retained within the garden beds in the gardens is very very pleasing to see.

Thats a good one from 2006 for more recent ones search the Ancient Tree Forum site or alternatively just email him...despite all the dubious accounts of his temper I have found Ted to be generous with his time and his knowledge.

Fair point...I have really only been referring to t/R ratio unease. Perhaps something of a derail from the threads real intention and focus VTA debate....sorry The Stuttgart table of wood strength is published by Wessolly and Erb and forms a major foundation of their SIA approach can be viewed (in part) pages 6 and 7 here http://www2.tree-consult.org/images/pdf/eng/brudi_trees_and_statics.pdf along with a description of how those values were derived.