FdSC, TreeLife, BSc, level 3, level 4, 5, 6? arrgh!

[Chris at eden]

Of course I can understand having advanced knowledge of a subject being helpful, desirable even, to ease a passage through a course. I dare say the advanced knowledge would benefit anyone taking a similar course, and being an online student can feel a little remote so best to be forewarned and feeling forearmed.

 

However to be competent as you stated, conveys that the OP would need the necessary skills and knowledge in the subject - in advance, which is obviously not why anyone would take a course ie to learn what they already know.

 

This may seem like a discussion of semantics, but I think its important to state that there is a significant difference in being prepared to learn, rather than having to be competent in the subject in the first place. If the OP is not competent in advance - should that be a bar to his progress?

 

I believe having the correct mindset and preparedness for learning, both before and during the course, would be as beneficial as becoming competent in the subject mater beforehand.

 

Some foundation knowledge, interest and desire to learn and be academically challenged, yes. Competency in all the subject matter however, is not required at the outset of a course.

 

 

I would agree with this particularly if you are talking about plant science which would be better acquired from a lecturer than from working as a tree surgeon. The majority of people doing degrees will complete these prior to gaining any kind of experience in whatever their field. Yes you need the underpinning knowledge but that is why the QCF is built on levels and courses have pre-requisites. Surely?

 

You will never come out of university knowing everything but if you have a good academic grounding then surely this must enrich the experience you then go on to gain. I personally have always found that experience vs. qualifications argument to be a little superfluous. Surely you need both.

[10 Bears]

Chris,

 

This wasn't an experience vs. qualifications discussion per se, it was based around the need to be fully competent in particular subject matter (ie plant science) in advance.

 

My view is that you don't need to be competent in the subject in advance of attempting a course, others views were that you would need to be competent in the subject to do an FdSc course.

 

I take this view as I don't think it is right that the OP is discouraged from his ambition on advice which I will paraphrase, that the course is 'too hard unless you know it all first'

[Chris at eden]

Chris,

 

This wasn't an experience vs. qualifications discussion per se, it was based around the need to be fully competent in particular subject matter (ie plant science) in advance.

 

My view is that you don't need to be competent in the subject in advance of attempting a course, others views were that you would need to be competent in the subject to do an FdSc course.

 

I take this view as I don't think it is right that the OP is discouraged from his ambition on advice which I will paraphrase, that the course is 'too hard unless you know it all first'

 

Yes I know. I agree with that view.

 

I went off on a bit of a tangent when I got to the end as I thought of the old experience vs. qualifications debate and thought it worth mentioning. Probably should not have done it while responding to your comments as a quote as it looks like I was commenting on a point you hadn't made. Sorry about that.

[Billy]

What makes these Arb courses so special? I left school and did a presumably L6 course I.e a degree straight off the bat, it was easy. Surely this is no different unless we're assuming the OP is a halfwit ?

[Kveldssanger]

It requires a lot of work, a degree level course. Did the same as you, Billy. Certainly doable, however.

[Chris at eden]

What makes these Arb courses so special? I left school and did a presumably L6 course I.e a degree straight off the bat, it was easy. Surely this is no different unless we're assuming the OP is a halfwit ?

 

Nothing special about them. Level 6 isn't hard in terms of the level, just a lot of work. If you put the effort in you should be ok. The difference with my L6 and someone doing full time uni was, I was working full time as a TO, I was starting my consultancy business from scratch, and my son was born 3 months into my first year. Not enough hours in the day. Actually there was, I just didn't watch TV or have a social life for two years. Doable though if you want it enough. I would imagine a lot of people on here are in the same position with working and studying at the same time and families to support. That's what makes it harder.

[diervek]

What makes these Arb courses so special? I left school and did a presumably L6 course I.e a degree straight off the bat, it was easy. Surely this is no different unless we're assuming the OP is a halfwit ?

 

I'm no halfwit but only now, at 34, I've just found my academic mind. At school / college............struggled with making sense of what I was supposed to be doing, so I got drunk, chased girls, and generally just had a good time.

 

The last thing I want to do now is blow £2.5k on the first year of a degree to find I've made a bad decision by running before I could walk, hence my initial posed question.

 

I spoke to Treelife today, and Keely(?) advised that the level 4 would be difficult without experience within the industry, as Betula pointed out — I'm a warehouse manager at present without any experience in arboriculture — so I'm thinking I need to take a step back from my five year plan, work on getting my foot in and revisit education in a year or so, but there is that nagging imp on my shoulder that is saying "you're 34! If you don't crack on soon you'll have to retire" — the little sod!

 

I've had positive feedback from a local forestry consultancy firm that has offered some work experience when I complete my RFS/ABC level 2 in July.

In the meantime, I recently got my CS30/31, and my CS38 is in Jan. A guy from my current course is taking me out for a rec. climb next week, and I'm applying for jobs here and there.

It's just an uphill struggle at the moment. Every time I think I have it straight in my head a new obstacle rears up and forces me to change the outlook, the biggest of which is my girlfriend dropping a positive pregnancy test on my desk....

 

So the new plan;

1. Complete my RFS level 2
   
2. Be an awesome dad to first child
   
3. Find work & experience in Arb through 2016/17
   
4. Enrol and complete the level 4 in 2017
   
5. Enrol and complete the level 6 in 2018
   
6. Be happy and finally get job satisfaction
   

 

Simple...

Edited November 29, 2015 by David Humphries
Watch the language please

[jaime bray]

One of the considerations to the 2,4,6. Route is that as you move through the various stages grades levels, the next element to your learning of each particular subject/topic is a step on from that at the previous level. It is presumed in the manner that the next grade up course progresses that elements of the knowledge have already been acquired. Where this hasn't been achieved, it can lead to significant strains and stalling in your studying. Additional too this though, if you are in a classroom of people who have the required previous knowledge then you begin to affect the progression of their studying, as tutor has to explain things to you. This in my opinion is not fair to the other students.

 

When, in 2005, decided I wanted a level six qualification I assessed what I already had. A level 3 nd arb achieved in 1995. Having not studied for ten years and ran my own business i decided to go back to level 2 cert arb. Then tech cert, level four. I attended tech cert management day on October 7th2010, and started level six two days later. I was advised not to by tree life. They said consolidated your knowledge with consultancy experience. But i wanted level six with the management day element, not the qcf method.

 

Level six pd arb does get easier with consultancy experience.

 

One other thing that became apparent is that those who have a degree in a non related subject find it easier to write at level six standard in arboriculture than many that do not have degree. I mention degree, in another non related subject as degrees teach you how to write about subject at that level of academia.

Edited November 28, 2015 by jaime bray

[Arborist]

The level 6 is looked at as being competence based and the BSc academic.

I had been asking my self the same question as you over the last year and have decided to go the L6 route.

I was a student with treelife when I was studying the Tech Cert, being taught my Andy Summerley and am now on the L6 being taught by Dave Dowson. You can't beat there teaching methods or the back up recived from Keely.

[Arborist]

It's also worth taking into consideration that at this present time the L6 doesn't qualify enough points for charters status. Hopefully this will change.