TPOs - are they important?

[Kveldssanger]

It's just my interpretation of why the question was asked / suggestion made that abolition of the TPO process might be appropriate (and I may have a totally different interpretation to others) but could it be the case that the amount of admin / regulation is disproportionate to the number of infringements / prosecutions associated with TPO regs? For example, in comparison with speeding / shop lifting / disorder etc etc.... there's a law, it's applied, there are prosecutions. Or is it that the suitability of TPO legislation is the very reason that there are (comparatively) so few prosecutions?

 

I think it's the lack of desire to prosecute as (1) "it's only a damn tree!"; (2) it costs a lot more than one could probably recoup or justify spending, both in man hours and in GBP and; (3) trees aren't as accessible as speeding, anti-social behavior, and speeding, in terms of either knowledge or general public awareness.

 

I'm sure many people don't even know TPOs are a thing. I also know some simply don't care if a tree is even TPOd - it's being felled anyway. And when an LPA can't monitor or review it's TPO stock, how long would it take for someone to notice unless a vigilant member of the public informed the LPA?

[daltontrees]

I'll give my opinion on 3 and 4

3: reduce the number of trees with TPOs by 95%

4: not very much if my experience here is anything to go by.

 

And your answers to q1 and 2?

[daltontrees]

Prediction: responses will polarise into (i) people who reailse how important trees can be, who then say the system deleloped by a century of enlightened minds for enlightened voters is necessary and needs supported despite Britain's current Aldi mentality and (ii) people who don't appreciate how to use the system and who stand to benefit financially from removal of the need to think or to care about anyone or anything but themselves, now.

 

Over to Arbtalkers to fill in the details...

 

Yours, miserably oiling the wheels of a handcart destined for Hades...

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

I've been pondering it throughout the day today! Just didn't get chance to sit down and do it! I'm not sure, how ever the questions are constructed, it'll get as much interest as a thread where someone bashes their gums about getting an infraction.....

 

I think there would (should) be a difference in opinion between urban / rural contributors, the environments / challenges are so different. I'd like to see greater focus on protecting trees that have the potential to become veteran / ancient (I've got a few in mind, very rural, in farmland, and I'm considering 'testing' the system and submitting applications for TPO status - I think there may be an acid test situation then.

 

And I also think the challenge is yet to come with a predicted uplift in housing demand.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

I think it's the lack of desire to prosecute as (1) "it's only a damn tree!"; (2) it costs a lot more than one could probably recoup or justify spending, both in man hours and in GBP and; (3) trees aren't as accessible as speeding, anti-social behavior, and speeding, in terms of either knowledge or general public awareness.

 

I'm sure many people don't even know TPOs are a thing. I also know some simply don't care if a tree is even TPOd - it's being felled anyway. And when an LPA can't monitor or review it's TPO stock, how long would it take for someone to notice unless a vigilant member of the public informed the LPA?

 

Para 1 spot on! (not in the public interest - maybe because the public ain't interested?)

 

Para 2 spot on! (see brackets above!)

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

On reflection,

 

Para 1 is an organisational problem

Para 2 is somewhat different

[Kveldssanger]

I've been pondering it throughout the day today! Just didn't get chance to sit down and do it! I'm not sure, how ever the questions are constructed, it'll get as much interest as a thread where someone bashes their gums about getting an infraction.....

 

I was thinking much the same...

 

 

I think there would (should) be a difference in opinion between urban / rural contributors, the environments / challenges are so different. I'd like to see greater focus on protecting trees that have the potential to become veteran / ancient (I've got a few in mind, very rural, in farmland, and I'm considering 'testing' the system and submitting applications for TPO status - I think there may be an acid test situation then.

 

Absolutely. This would probably need to see guidance change, and planning officers accept the professional judgement of the TO as justification for such a preservation. If it went to appeal however, how would it fare?

 

I have begun to, as an aside, leave standing stems from dead trees with natural fracture cuts, undertake veteranisation techniques on trees, and leave felled deadwood within hedgerows. Again however, this is met by some tree contractors with passive objection. When those within the industry don't even care / understand, what hope is there?

 

 

And I also think the challenge is yet to come with a predicted uplift in housing demand.

 

Unfortunately, the end game is bleak. In fact, I'm not even sure there is an end game, until we have literally paved over everything.

 

I await the day when it is declared we can now artificially pollinate crops and, as such, bees are surplus to requirements.

[Mick Dempsey]

And your answers to q1 and 2?

 

1. doesn't need answering bearing in mind 3/4

2. It's been a decade since I dealt with it, but I'm coming back soon to reduce two tpo'd trees for family members and have been dismayed by the paperwork needed for reductions on what I regard as transitory, low value trees, ie birch.

Still, you won't get many TOs on here saying the same, turkeys don't vote for Christmas do they?

[Kveldssanger]

2. It's been a decade since I dealt with it, but I'm coming back soon to reduce two tpo'd trees for family members and have been dismayed by the paperwork needed for reductions on what I regard as transitory, low value trees, ie birch.

Still, you won't get many TOs on here saying the same, turkeys don't vote for Christmas do they?

 

Define "low value". Are we talking economically, visually, personally, environmentally, ecologically?

 

Someone thought they were worth preserving, so they were of at least some value to someone.

 

Taking that into account, I did see a few TPO'd lawsons the other day. I was a little perplexed, though there may be greater context as to why they are TPOd.

[Paul Cleaver]

At the same time, would one not expect for trees to be preserved in conjunction with development?

 

What about urban woodland Orders - are they important? If urban infill is desired, how would one value the area Order for the woodland?

 

 

To add to the discussions, taken from Trees and Towns II:

 

A total of 96,342 individual TPOs were identified as currently being administered by those LAs that stated they administered some TPOs. This gave an average of 423 TPOs per LA. However, some 7% of the LAs had more than 1,000 TPOs each. The average number of new TPOs made by these LAs in the financial year 2003/04 was nearly 17.

 

I wonder how it fares today... TiT2 is 10 years old now...

 

One would hope for the above but in my area its a sad state of affairs really - LA 's are underfunded at the moment - I guess trees are not a major priority unfortunately - someone illegally felled a TPO tree and couldn't afford to take them to court!! - they haven't even cut the grass yet on the verge outside our house!!