Instructor / Technician @ Sparsholt College

[Andy Clark]

I'm sure everyone would like more money... tell our HR department... no wait, the Learning Skills Council... no wait, tell Gorden Brown. As you work for a LA you must be aware of how policies / funding levels etc are set at a national level. If we could change things here I'm sure we would! All you've got to do is read the papers these days to see that 'efficiencies' are being looked for across the civil service.

 

I appreciate the sentiment guys and totally see where you're coming from. The fact of the matter is that if we wanted to pay staff more (in the education sector) then courses would have to be charged to the student at a higher rate. It's all relative.

 

The benefits I mentioned include becoming an NPTC assessor / LOLER inspector where you can earn £200 a day. Do a couple of days a month and things start to look a little different.

 

 

If that's the case then, why was the recent lecturers job wage (and i quote from the job spec) 'increased to reflect current market factors' to somewhere iro £30k per annum??

 

 

And surely, the annual £10k ish drop in wages that a Tech Cert qualified person would be taking, would more than cover the costs of putting themselves through LOLER inspector or NPTC assessor training??

 

 

Don't get me wrong Gimmer, i used to be a lecturer myself (on £24k/annum) so I know where you're coming from, but the pure and simple fact is..... well, it speaks for itself.

[skyhuck]

Yes I did not have a great amount of experiance to get into the job but I dont think you really need it as you are there to teach the basics .

 

I find this a disturbing statement.

[Mark T]

If that's the case then, why was the recent lecturers job wage (and i quote from the job spec) 'increased to reflect current market factors' to somewhere iro £30k per annum??

 

 

And surely, the annual £10k ish drop in wages that a Tech Cert qualified person would be taking, would more than cover the costs of putting themselves through LOLER inspector or NPTC assessor training??

 

 

Don't get me wrong Gimmer, i used to be a lecturer myself (on £24k/annum) so I know where you're coming from, but the pure and simple fact is..... well, it speaks for itself.

 

Hi Andy... I assume you're the Andy Clark who works with Chris at Urban?

 

I'm afraid its not as simple as it should be / used to be mate! Lecturers and Instructor / Technicians (I'm going to call them I/Ts 'cos I'm getting arm ache writing it in full!!) are on completely different payscales, lecturers are classed as academic staff and I/Ts are support staff. Lecturer's payscales have recently been 'standardized' upwards slightly and I/Ts have been shifted down and had some add-on's (lecturer uplift etc) removed.

 

I hope that explains things... well spotted though by the way!! Regards to Chris and Reg.

[Andy Clark]

I find this a disturbing statement.

 

 

Here Here!!!

 

 

But then that's the WHOOOOOOOOOLE problem, isn't it.....

 

 

I had 17 years experience when i started teaching..... the moment i found out what, who and how i was expected to teach, i resigned! After one term! As a matter of principal!

 

It's also the same reason why i turned down the recent Sparsholt lecturer job (despite the £30k ish salary), when i was approached by a recruitment company.

 

IMO, You'd be hard pressed to find anyone with the knowledge level of Tech Cert and with any decent amount of time served in the industry, (regardless of salary) that would stick at a college job.

[Andy Clark]

Hi Andy... I assume you're the Andy Clark who works with Chris at Urban?

 

I'm afraid its not as simple as it should be / used to be mate! Lecturers and Instructor / Technicians (I'm going to call them I/Ts 'cos I'm getting arm ache writing it in full!!) are on completely different payscales, lecturers are classed as academic staff and I/Ts are support staff. Lecturer's payscales have recently been 'standardized' upwards slightly and I/Ts have been shifted down and had some add-on's (lecturer uplift etc) removed.

 

I hope that explains things... well spotted though by the way!! Regards to Chris and Reg.

 

No.... i'm not that Andy Clark.

 

Sorry.

[Mark T]

 

IMO, You'd be hard pressed to find anyone with the knowledge level of Tech Cert and with any decent amount of time served in the industry, (regardless of salary) that would stick at a college job.

 

 

I had 11yrs behind me when I began teaching as well as the Tech Cert, I've been her 3 and a half years now and have never been so utterly stressed out (running my own business was a doddle by comparison). Sleepless nights due to workload are the norm, 65 - 70 hr weeks for no extra money and little recognition pretty standard, more paperwork than you can shake a stick at etc etc...

 

Will I be here for ever? Who knows. The main thing that keeps me from binning it is a responsibility to the students (that, the money, the holidays!!). Yes, you will get abused by 'the system'... but if you don't suck it up and look after the poor buggers - who the hell will?

 

This is becoming some kind of therapy session!

Edited August 18, 2009 by Mark T

[Andy Clark]

 

IMO, You'd be hard pressed to find anyone with the knowledge level of Tech Cert and with any decent amount of time served in the industry, (regardless of salary) that would stick at a college job.

 

Of course, the other point to consider in this, is the work expectation.... regardless of salary.

 

Can you really and trully see a Tech Cert qualed individual, working as, and carrying out the day to day duties of a Technician?? (What basically boils down to a classroom assistant)

 

 

Making sure saws are ready and that there's enough fuel in the store for the days use.

 

Making sure climbing kit's are pre-organised, and if need be (dependant on the session) pre-installing climbing lines.

 

Collecting fungi/branch/twig samples for ident sessions.

 

 

Don't get me wrong Gimmer, this isn't particularly a rant about the college or your advert........ but has the Tech Cert (or that level of qual) REALLY been reduced to THIS level???

[Andy Clark]

I had 11yrs behind me when I began teaching as well as the Tech Cert, I've been her 3 and a half years now and have never been so utterly stressed out (running my own business was a doddle by comparison). Sleepless nights due to workload are the norm, 65 - 70 hr weeks for no extra money and little recognition pretty standard, more paperwork than you can shake a stick at etc etc...

 

Will I be here for ever? Who knows. The main thing that keeps me from binning it is a responsibility to the students (that, the money, the holidays!!). Yes, you will get abused by 'the system'... but if you don't suck it up and look after the poor buggers - who the hell will?

 

This is becoming some kind of therapy session!

 

 

Bet you never expected this kind of response when you posted the ad??

 

Seriously though.... don't take it personally.

 

To be totally honest with you, i had exactly the same moral dilema when i packed it in. I come from a very long Scouting background.... 25+ years on the service crew at our local campsite, activity instructor for the past 2 of those, and for me, it was a very similar mentality that drew me to teaching.

 

I loved it, i loved the whole mentality of giving something back, and watching and helping all those struggling up and coming students to grow and achieve... it was great, and i do still very much miss it!

 

 

BUT.... I love my industry more!

 

And for me, there was no way on god's green earth, that i was gonna compound the problems that lie within this industry, by being part of something that watered it down.

 

But that's just my story.

[Stephen Blair]

surely this is tasks that the students can carry out, make the 2 best kids the classroom assistants. give them responsibilities. if every morning they come to college and the saws are magically filled up and sharp and clean, no wonder they havent a clue when they come to us. next you will be telling us you do their washing. if you have 20 students(guessing) and each did a little bit to help out, then surely your life would be easier. deligate man. if i heard one single student talk in my class while i was teaching, he would now be my bitch. running errands, cleaning saws, getting me my tea and coffee, if he fell behind then he would soon give himself a shake. i remember being atgreenkeeping college and most of the guys would sit there smoking reading a paper, and the teacher would just stand there trying to get the session over with. there was no morral, we were all bored out our head. 3 years i went there and scrapped through with the bare minimium. you just lost the notion and after a while you just gave up and fell asleep.

[Andy Clark]

Gimmer....

 

To steer this thread back on track, you may want to turn your attentions to this little beauty...

 

http://arbtalk.co.uk/forum/training-education/9118-do-students-learn-any-thing.html