Genetic modification- your views please

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Not going to preach to anyone here, just curious about the level of understanding of GM and views as to whether it is a good or a bad thing.

 

Its common knowledge that I am 100% against GM, and with good cause.

 

This article I saw today is just another example of the madness

 

GM bees tolerant to roundup, just so we can keep on spraying those petrochemicals the company involved also sells:sneaky2:

 

The Fox (Monsanto) Buys the Chicken Coop (Beeologics) | The Liberty Beacon

[Paul Barton]

I don't claim to know alot about it since I last read about it in-depth over 10 years ago. My impression then was that GM has the capability to be a force for good, particularly in the developing world. Genetically modifying crop plants to be more drought resistant and to travel better where refrigeration is lacking seem like laudible ideas. I also remember reading about new rice varieties that contain more vitamins that can stop infant blindness....

 

However, I am sceptical about the motivations of large corporations that invest in GM - particularly where there are blatant conflicts of interest.

 

Some people are against stem cell research as it begins to question ethical boundaries - but stem cell research saved my mothers life so it can be used for good. Some people don't like the internet because it gives immediate access to all sorts of information, good and bad. I view GM in the same kind of way; something with the potential for good things but at risk of being used in the 'wrong' way.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

I don't claim to know alot about it since I last read about it in-depth over 10 years ago. My impression then was that GM has the capability to be a force for good, particularly in the developing world. Genetically modifying crop plants to be more drought resistant and to travel better where refrigeration is lacking seem like laudible ideas. I also remember reading about new rice varieties that contain more vitamins that can stop infant blindness....

 

However, I am sceptical about the motivations of large corporations that invest in GM - particularly where there are blatant conflicts of interest.

 

Some people are against stem cell research as it begins to question ethical boundaries - but stem cell research saved my mothers life so it can be used for good. Some people don't like the internet because it gives immediate access to all sorts of information, good and bad. I view GM in the same kind of way; something with the potential for good things but at risk of being used in the 'wrong' way.

 

What do you think of the potential consequences of "getting this wrong" I mean man has historicaly made a complete mess of everything, what about the genepool?

[Goaty]

If it was pursued at a scientific and academic level, we could learn maybe, its a bit like testing on animals and nazi war medical torture/testing. Science gained, all be it brutally. instead we have the wholesale deluge we are getting from certain quarters, much of it unknown I reckon. Only to look at horsemeat scandal, if it makes profits and you can get away with it, do it. I will be drawing my big fat pension soon mentality prevails.

 

A relative of ours was a farm worker and saw a helicopter applying pesticides crash on the farm he worked. Both in copter were dead but he went to help got exposed to leaking chemicals and months later, dead from cancer. Was a healthy chap until that point. Rapidly deterioted.

 

My point is if we had genetically altered him to be resistant yes he would still be here perhaps, but he would of carried everything poisonous inside him and excreted it to poison other things. There is an excellent chapter in Bill Brysons book "A brief history of everything" that has a chapter on how lead was first embraced in fuel, paint etc. Worth reading Tony. Fantastic informative book with pages at back of reference sources.

 

Personally I don't trust it (GM) its mutated just like cancer and cloning which is a failure at the dolly level that brings weakness. which is all GM will do long term. You have again put a topic on the forum that may come back and bite you, if some gung ho chainsaw wielding primates come at you Tony take it on the chin. Many wont care about this subject until it has affected them, then it will be so bad.

[Paul Barton]

What do you think of the potential consequences of "getting this wrong" I mean man has historicaly made a complete mess of everything, what about the genepool?

 

I think (without much knowledge!) that the potential consequences are huge - messing with ecosystems always seems to have unexpected effects somewhere down the line that nobody saw coming. Nature is so complex and finely balanced that I believe we are playing with fire when we try to bend it to our will.

 

I would contest your comment about man making a mess of everything though - mankind has done some pretty good stuff too.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

If it was pursued at a scientific and academic level, we could learn maybe, its a bit like testing on animals and nazi war medical torture/testing. Science gained, all be it brutally. instead we have the wholesale deluge we are getting from certain quarters, much of it unknown I reckon. Only to look at horsemeat scandal, if it makes profits and you can get away with it, do it. I will be drawing my big fat pension soon mentality prevails.

 

A relative of ours was a farm worker and saw a helicopter applying pesticides crash on the farm he worked. Both in copter were dead but he went to help got exposed to leaking chemicals and months later, dead from cancer. Was a healthy chap until that point. Rapidly deterioted.

 

My point is if we had genetically altered him to be resistant yes he would still be here perhaps, but he would of carried everything poisonous inside him and excreted it to poison other things. There is an excellent chapter in Bill Brysons book "A brief history of everything" that has a chapter on how lead was first embraced in fuel, paint etc. Worth reading Tony. Fantastic informative book with pages at back of reference sources.

 

Personally I don't trust it (GM) its mutated just like cancer and cloning which is a failure at the dolly level that brings weakness. which is all GM will do long term. You have again put a topic on the forum that may come back and bite you, if some gung ho chainsaw wielding primates come at you Tony take it on the chin. Many wont care about this subject until it has affected them, then it will be so bad.

 

I know much of what I do will bite me, but we should never be afraid of the dark:biggrin:

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

I think (without much knowledge!) that the potential consequences are huge - messing with ecosystems always seems to have unexpected effects somewhere down the line that nobody saw coming. Nature is so complex and finely balanced that I believe we are playing with fire when we try to bend it to our will.

 

I would contest your comment about man making a mess of everything though - mankind has done some pretty good stuff too.

 

 

I am having a tough time believing that man has achieved anything good when we kill for oil and rape the environment, kind of outwieghs any positive effects of our existence IMO

[Paul Barton]

I am having a tough time believing that man has achieved anything good when we kill for oil and rape the environment, kind of outwieghs any positive effects of our existence IMO

 

That's a shame. Life can be a bit heavy when you can't see good in your fellow man.

Edited March 9, 2013 by Paul Barton

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

That's a shame. Life can be a bit heavy when you can't see good triumph over evil.

 

indeed, and it does at times become a little too heavy hence my at times and often distraught state as I learn the depths to which we sink with such things.

 

Vandana shiva has scientifically proven that organic, bio diverse farming methods out yield GM and mono-cultures.

 

the global food crisis will result because of the likes of the big corps and their blatant disregard for natural systems, not because of any real dangers, they will probably manufacture the problems and come forth with the solutions, like with this Bee thing.

[Paul Barton]

That's capitalism for you. Ms Shiva has less shareholders interested in her work that Monsanto etc.

 

Have you heard of Transition Towns? I think you'd like this book: http://www.cs.toronto.edu/~sme/CSC2600/transition-handbook.pdf

 

It's more about independence from oil than GM, but I think you'd like the spirit of it.