The amazon- unnatural histories!

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

BBC Four - Unnatural Histories, Amazon

[MikeTM150]

agreed, but there is also an aspect of global trade that matters, that countries are more inclined to work together in the global interests for eachother as apposed to just for themselves. so say if the amazon is the lungs of the earth and benifits europe we have some trade benifits in which to encourage conservation there. why trade imbargos work.

 

very true, and we rely on global trade for products we can't produce ourselves. Population size is really the problem, and thats not going to stop increasing in the near future!

 

The problem with deforestation these days, is it happens too quickly and too aggresively. But when someones going to make a pound or two there'll always be somebody who'll be there doing it no matter what the ehtics are.

 

Its a great shame and i think your right promoting a trade platform that encourages sustainable use of resources has a higher possibility of effecting a sustainable response.

[David Goss]

BBC Four - Unnatural Histories, Amazon

 

Cheers mate watching now:thumbup:

[David Goss]

Yep that was very interesting indeed:thumbup1:

Just shows that the ancient cultures knew how to live in harmony with the environment and not destroy everything around them in the name of progress. Humans nowadays have such a big problem that there is just too many of us to live like that. There is not enough space for so many people and there comes a point where we do more harm than good to our surroundings imo. Great programme Hama cheers for posting:thumbup:

[Gnarlyoak]

not if like the amazonians we can live amoung the trees and actualy manage the habitat in ways that INCREASE its yields and biodiversity!

 

I feel Alan Rayner is wholey or "holey" as he prefers! right about "lost knowledge/wisdom":001_rolleyes:

 

Ahh, but even the program made the point that the indigenous Amozonian peoples could only support a limited sized community. Once the community became too large, the patch of jungle in which they lived was no longer able to sustain them. the earth became exhausted, and bush meat became scare.

 

Once this became the case, these communities could of course move on and set up camp in a new area of forest and start afresh, in the knowledge that their old site would over a period of time recover from the stress placed on it by their former habitation.

 

With the encroachment of "industrial civilisation" and the clearance of the rainforests this is becoming harder and harder for the few remaining tribes that eschew the modern world in favour of their traditional lifestyle to be able to do this.

 

But of course sustainability of the environment is not the only issue, living without all mod cons, a large dietry option and the lack of health care, means that the indigenous people generally have a shorter lifespan, and have a much higher infant mortality rate which mean that are more able to live within the means that their environment provides.

 

Modern humans are over populating at an exponential rate that is intensively raping the earth of its limited resources faster than it can recover. Sooner or later there will be a tipping point, the ramification of which would probably be felt globally on a biblical scale. Perhaps nuclear armageddon as we fight over the last glass of drinkable water and last slice of edible bread!

[David Goss]

Ahh, but even the program made the point that the indigenous Amozonian peoples could only support a limited sized community. Once the community became too large, the patch of jungle in which they lived was no longer able to sustain them. the earth became exhausted, and bush meat became scare.

 

Once this became the case, these communities could of course move on and set up camp in a new area of forest and start afresh, in the knowledge that their old site would over a period of time recover from the stress placed on it by their former habitation.

 

With the encroachment of "industrial civilisation" and the clearance of the rainforests this is becoming harder and harder for the few remaining tribes that eschew the modern world in favour of their traditional lifestyle to be able to do this.

 

But of course sustainability of the environment is not the only issue, living without all mod cons, a large dietry option and the lack of health care, means that the indigenous people generally have a shorter lifespan, and have a much higher infant mortality rate which mean that are more able to live within the means that their environment provides.

 

Modern humans are over populating at an exponential rate that is intensively raping the earth of its limited resources faster than it can recover. Sooner or later there will be a tipping point, the ramification of which would probably be felt globally on a biblical scale. Perhaps nuclear armageddon as we fight over the last glass of drinkable water and last slice of edible bread!

 

Thats what i was trying to say but with less words:lol:

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

NO, the program made the point that europeans brought disease and the population crashed, it made the point that the small scale situation was not what existed before, that in fact large stable long term communities existed

[David Goss]

NO, the program made the point that europeans brought disease and the population crashed, it made the point that the small scale situation was not what existed before, that in fact large stable long term communities existed

 

very true but not as large as we would conceive as large nowadays, the numbers of population they were talking about doesnt even come close to a large modern city and they are talking about the entire amazon area which is way bigger than any city.

[gibbon]

One of the worst human atrocities were the missionaries. As soon as they got people living in perminant settlement and persecuted people for using local medicines and herbs, whole cultures were lost. In the end even people who wanted to return to a sustainable live style were unable to do so.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

very true but not as large as we would conceive as large nowadays, the numbers of population they were talking about doesnt even come close to a large modern city and they are talking about the entire amazon area which is way bigger than any city.

 

5 million plus peoples in the river basin.