Pollards, the forgotten art-discussion

[born2trot]

Interesting post Hama.

Excuse my ignorance , but is pollarding mentioned anywhere in industry best practise? If it is not then it needs to be , if it is then its being ignored.

It is after all a guideline only and if more of us tree surgeons can learn from experienced hands or education days then it will become a more regular solution. I for one would be interested in a pollarding course run by proven academics.

The ball needs to start rolling.... so roll it

[treeseer]

Pollarding is in the US ANSI standards, and also is covered there under "restoration pruning"

 

It's in the BS thing too i am told.

 

What are you expecting from "proven academics"? Few of them climb. Have you read Dr. David Lonsdale's book on tree risk? It's well-mentioned there, as i recall.

 

The ball is rolling; you'll have to go faster than a trot to catch up!

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

I will do some reading over the next few days and try to put together a better thread, I wish I was able to do decent drawings!

[born2trot]

Pollarding is in the US ANSI standards, and also is covered there under "restoration pruning"

 

It's in the BS thing too i am told.

 

What are you expecting from "proven academics"? Few of them climb. Have you read Dr. David Lonsdale's book on tree risk? It's well-mentioned there, as i recall.

 

The ball is rolling; you'll have to go faster than a trot to catch up!

 

Thanks for the reply ' treeseer '

You seem to imply that we shouldn't listen to ' proven academics ' and seek the assistance of climbers instead but then you refer me to DR David Lonsdale

I have read his book incidently and I can do no better than give you his own words in relation to pollard work...

 

' The above considerations can be translated into some TENTATIVE guidelines, but THESE ARE BY NO MEANS FULLY TRIED AND TESTED ; nor are they a prescription that can substitute for individual and sensitive management based on local knowledge and on experience with particular species or provenances of trees '.

 

Doesn't exactly sound like a man willing to put his neck on the line does it?

 

Another thing which Dr Lonsdale advocates is the importance of drought stress in determining when to pollard ( or if to pollard ! ) something that seems to get lost amongst the friendly banter:001_smile:

I'll try and trot as fast as you yanks!! cheers 'b2t'

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Thanks for the reply ' treeseer '

You seem to imply that we shouldn't listen to ' proven academics ' and seek the assistance of climbers instead but then you refer me to DR David Lonsdale

I have read his book incidently and I can do no better than give you his own words in relation to pollard work...

 

' The above considerations can be translated into some TENTATIVE guidelines, but THESE ARE BY NO MEANS FULLY TRIED AND TESTED ; nor are they a prescription that can substitute for individual and sensitive management based on local knowledge and on experience with particular species or provenances of trees '.

 

Doesn't exactly sound like a man willing to put his neck on the line does it?

 

Another thing which Dr Lonsdale advocates is the importance of drought stress in determining when to pollard ( or if to pollard ! ) something that seems to get lost amongst the friendly banter:001_smile:

I'll try and trot as fast as you yanks!! cheers 'b2t'

 

I have mentioned not doing it in drought several times, and when reducing also, same applies. the only pollard i ever killed was a willow drought stressed I thought being beside a lake would help, but it did not. massive cambium death occurred.

 

Dr David Lonsdale is our finest academic arboriculturist and doesnt stick his neck out for anything less than proven fact and for good reason, he is a consummate pro, and I for one would aspire to be even half the professional he is, not saying you detracted, just my views.

 

He is also very approachable which is a rare thing for such a man, and it speaks volumes of the guy, especialy putting up with a tonka like me at seminars!

[Treecreeper1961]

We're just about to do a 100+ foot Poplar. Initially it was to be felled due to concerns of owner of neighbouring property. The tree leans and is made very one-sided by a couple of almighty limbs in direction of house, but not actually anywhere near it. But I met with the Forestry Commission guy and the client and we have persuaded the client to keep the tree. The FC said ok to pollard. But a proper pollard on a mature Poplar..... isn't that going to lead to further problems? I was surprised the FC bloke said to pollard, rather than side prune the large limbs and drop-crotch others to reduce and balance. Or have I misunderstood what he meant by pollard?

 

About four years ago I pollarded a fifty to sixty foot poplar hybrid growing between and above two static caravans, to a height of about fifteen foot, just above the first major union.

This year it was felled, almost completely dead and riddled with Armillaria mellea.

Last winter I pollarded an eighty foot hybrid poplar, again over two caravans, on the same site. Again this was brought down to leave a fairly large stem, cut just above the first union.

There is no doubt in my mind the result will probably be the same.

The reason for pollarding as apposed to pruning or removal?

Pruning would not have satisfied the management objectives as the caravan owners wanted the trees made safe in no uncertain terms.

Removal? Well that would have meant bringing down several cubes between two caravans and would have cost more than a few quid more.

Also, there is the lack of knowledge regarding species suitability for severe reductions from those specifying the work.

Poplar are notoriously poor compartmentalisers with ripe wood rather than heart wood and a tendency to be readily colonized by decay organisms.

Who ever recommended planting these trees in this location clearly did not understand trees or have much foresight.

 

Now it looks like the monkey that butchered these trees was, well, a monkey.

 

Perhaps there was some technical inadequacy in the way I left these 'pollards'.

I am not proud, but orders is orders.

Perhaps this is not representative of others experiences of the species or genus but I am going to stick my neck out and say, in my opinion don't pollard a 100ft poplar unless you want to make it a habitat for fungi, be called back to finish the job in a few years and , best of all, look like a tree butchering rapist.

 

Sorry if that doesn't fit well, but it is one of my many guises. Don't tell anyone though.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

About four years ago I pollarded a fifty to sixty foot poplar hybrid growing between and above two static caravans, to a height of about fifteen foot, just above the first major union.

This year it was felled, almost completely dead and riddled with Armillaria mellea.

Last winter I pollarded an eighty foot hybrid poplar, again over two caravans, on the same site. Again this was brought down to leave a fairly large stem, cut just above the first union.

There is no doubt in my mind the result will probably be the same.

The reason for pollarding as apposed to pruning or removal?

Pruning would not have satisfied the management objectives as the caravan owners wanted the trees made safe in no uncertain terms.

Removal? Well that would have meant bringing down several cubes between two caravans and would have cost more than a few quid more.

Also, there is the lack of knowledge regarding species suitability for severe reductions from those specifying the work.

Poplar are notoriously poor compartmentalisers with ripe wood rather than heart wood and a tendency to be readily colonized by decay organisms.

Who ever recommended planting these trees in this location clearly did not understand trees or have much foresight.

 

Now it looks like the monkey that butchered these trees was, well, a monkey.

 

Perhaps there was some technical inadequacy in the way I left these 'pollards'.

I am not proud, but orders is orders.

Perhaps this is not representative of others experiences of the species or genus but I am going to stick my neck out and say, in my opinion don't pollard a 100ft poplar unless you want to make it a habitat for fungi, be called back to finish the job in a few years and , best of all, look like a tree butchering rapist.

 

Sorry if that doesn't fit well, but it is one of my many guises. Don't tell anyone though.

along the thames bank of Kew reside a group of black poplars, I pollarded these over 10 years ago, heavy too, leaving growth points (where viable) tha are doing fine seem to possibly ben done since some have lost limbs not due to pollarding but socket failures possibly associated with basal decay entries.

 

I was not proud of the job, but did it to the best of my abilities at the time and they are doing fine

[RobArb]

It does differ between the species, I've noticed certain pops take to the procedure better than others!

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

It does differ between the species, I've noticed certain pops take to the procedure better than others!

 

it does seem to be some hybrids in particular the balsam crosses that suffer most

[Treecreeper1961]

along the thames bank of Kew reside a group of black poplars, I pollarded these over 10 years ago, heavy too, leaving growth points (where viable) tha are doing fine seem to possibly ben done since some have lost limbs not due to pollarding but socket failures possibly associated with basal decay entries.

 

I was not proud of the job, but did it to the best of my abilities at the time and they are doing fine

 

Were the limbs that have been lost regrowth that failed due to weak attatchment typical of epicormic growth?

I did manage to leave some live growth but obviously not enough. I am sure that the value of retaining photosynthetic material is not to be underestimated.