Site clearance hypothetical question...

[Bryn the wood man]

Hi thanks for reading this. I'd really appreciate anyone's views.

 

Say I recently bought a site of about an acre, edge of town, long and thin with a mixture of semi mature broadleaf trees around the boundary (which I'm fine about keeping) and a strip of sycamore, ash, willow and others down the middle (about 20 tons) which I want to clear now for future development as a storage yard a couple of years down the line. No TPOs on the site at all and not in a conservation area.

 

Q1- I'm wondering whether to contact the Tree Officer, tell them my plans and keep them onside - but I'm concerned that if they are over keen they might protect the lot. I looked at the Govt guidance on applying TPOs and the trees I'm wanting to fell are not really visible from a public place (although the site has been used by dog walkers occasionally - I'm about to fence the boundary) and I am keeping the boundary trees intact. I wondered how much the TOs go beyond the guidance and how easy it is to appeal a TPO decision if I am slapped with one?

 

Q2- What happens when you apply for an FC felling licence? Does it sound the alarm at the Local Authority or anwhere else? adverts in the the local paper? Notice on site? And under what grounds might the FC refuse? there is possibly enough space if they required replanting but I'm not certain.

 

If I started felling I think the adjoining residents would be on the phone to the Local Authority within minutes so I want to plan in advance.

If any of the trees I want to fell were of significance or beauty I'd want to keep them but they are nothing amazing, all under 40 years old and a bit scrappy.

 

I had contractor look a the site, very professional, liked him a lot, he explained the options and he's leaving the decision on contacting the TO in my hands, and he recommends obtaining a felling licence if he did the work.

 

Many thanks in anticipation of your views

[Gary Prentice]

FC will consult the LPA or normally do. Assuming that none of the exemptions apply, you 're probably end up with officialdom.

Med

Planning can protect anything they want and argue the toss later. Public visibility has I believe been deemed to include surrounding properties, not necessarily general public views.

 

At an appeal meeting once, the TO argued one tree was visible from the hillside half a mile away.

[daltontrees]

If you're not in a hurry, you can fell 2 cubic metres (about 2 tonnes) per quarter without a felling license. Also anything less than 8cm diameter can be removed without license and doesn't come into the volume calculation. So you could in theory clear it out lawfully in 10 quarters (2 1/2 years).

 

If you're not selling the wood but are using it for yourself you can take 5 cubic metres a quarter (1 year to complete). Be careful, though, if you gave the wood to the contractor as part payment for the felling work, whether the value is ascertained or not, you are arguably selling it.

 

Now if the contractor felled, disced and stacked the wood for you to burn onsite in a new wood-heated future building, that might qualify for the 5 cube exemption.

 

I would advise not to be too cute about it. Get it all thinned (<8cm) in a day, get a visit from Planning at that point in reaction to chainsaws. Then take 2 cube every quarter. Entirely lawful. It's just harvesting.

[Gary Prentice]

 

I would advise not to be too cute about it. Get it all thinned (<8cm) in a day, get a visit from Planning at that point in reaction to chainsaws. Then take 2 cube every quarter. Entirely lawful. It's just harvesting.

 

But that doesn't mean the local authority agree with it and will condone harvesting operations. The risk is still there, that a woodland order is instigated, protecting everything including regrowth and regeneration.

 

Would a storage yard fit into the councils development plan. Search the UDP maps or similar on the council website to see what the locality comes under. The future development ideas, if they fit, may make things easier.

[daltontrees]

But that doesn't mean the local authority agree with it and will condone harvesting operations. The risk is still there, that a woodland order is instigated, protecting everything including regrowth and regeneration.

 

Would a storage yard fit into the councils development plan. Search the UDP maps or similar on the council website to see what the locality comes under. The future development ideas, if they fit, may make things easier.

 

But it's for the LA to decide what trees it wants to protect. If the trees were outstanding regardless of whether under threat, they would have been TPOd by now. If there's an imminent threat the LA will be watching the site for changes of ownership that would trigger an expediency TPO. If it's just a run-of-the-mill tree belt it's not for the owner to do the LA's job for it by flagging up potential tree loss.

 

And besides, the trees could be taken down with no change of use of the land in mind i.e. the trees could be harvested even if the owner had no intention to use the land for anything else, and it would be a perfectly reasonable use of a natural resurce. The perimeter trees remain in place, logs instead of fossil fuels are used for heat, the storage use is screened, a storage requirement is fulfilled, no laws have been broken and a reasonable balance has been struck between public and private interests.

 

The purchaser may already have taken a view on potential for change of use and hopefully has gone through due diligence and made enquiries or checked the Local Plan.

 

It's one of these 'hypothetical' questions. Starting a chainsaw to do lawful thinning is probably the most likely prompt for LA action or inaction. Sure, I would like to see trees remaining until their destiny is properly decided, but they're not my trees and from what I can tell there is no likely overriding public interest.

 

Just my thoughts about it anyway.

[slack ma girdle]

If you think the local residents are going to complain, i would speak to the tree officier first for his thoughts. If their is no public access and you are leaving the edge trees, then there is no reason for the trees to have a TPO placed on the remaining trees. Go one stage further and draw up a management plan for the wood, setting out what you are going to do over the next five years. This will give you further weight for the felling of the trees.

Regardless of volume you intend to extract, get a felling licence, it will save alot of hassle in the long run.

In a small wood in Dorset, within an hour of starting the saws, the local council recieved 90 calls complaining about the distruction, and the the police were onsite asking questions. I was working for the local council at the time.

[woodyguy]

You can fell 5cubic metres per calendar quarter if you are not selling it. So 30th Sept you fell 5 cu m then another 5cu metres the next day. Problem solved. If you're really worried about people phoning the council then 31st Dec and 1st Jan should be even safer!

[Bryn the wood man]

Much appreciated range of views there, many thanks.

 

The land is zoned for development but I've seen a few posts on here where the TOs beg to differ with the Development Plan and if the whole site was TPOd (unlikely but an unknown risk to me at present) it would neutralise any development. It could eventually be residential but for the moment I would like to go for open storage.

 

I'm now considering thinning out a small number- keeping it under 5 cu m, and then putting in for a licence to do what remains to be felled.

 

Thanks again for guiding me through this minefield - I will post with progress

[treesrus]

might be a good idea to have a barbie and invite all the neighbours, get on their side and mention you will be thinning a few small saplings in case they are worried by the chainsaw.