Listening for decay

[David Humphries]

By no means a ground breaking or new technique, but I'm interested in 'hearing' how many (& how often) people sound out dysfunction & decay on trees before climbing or whilst inspecting ?

 

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yh827aBNViY]Moby Oak - listening for decay - YouTube[/ame]

[treeseer]

By no means a ground breaking or new technique, but I'm interested in 'hearing' how many (& how often) people sound out dysfunction & decay on trees before climbing or whilst inspecting ?

Standard operating procedure here on almost any big old tree, thump 360 while inspecting dbh area and maybe the flare too..

[daltontrees]

Anything sizeable gets the rubber mallet from me, smaller stuff gets a precautionary gentle kick at about knee level with the rubber front of the boot. I don't know how anyopne could sign off a tree without literally sounding it out. You can tell such a lot with the hammer (or boot) where the eye can't go.

[David Humphries]

Standard operating procedure here on almost any big old tree, thump 360 while inspecting dbh area and maybe the flare too..

 

I had assumed as much, but glad you took the time to interact.

 

Do you know when (& by whos lead/example) this became common place in North American arboriculture?

 

 

 

Anything sizeable gets the rubber mallet from me, smaller stuff gets a precautionary gentle kick at about knee level with the rubber front of the boot. I don't know how anyopne could sign off a tree without literally sounding it out. You can tell such a lot with the hammer (or boot) where the eye can't go.

 

Have you tried the soft faced/nylon type hammer as opposed to rubber mallet Jules ?

 

Is choice of 'hitting implement' about preference or availability for you?

 

Do you think you can ascertain different types of decay via sounding?

 

 

 

Do you inform the watching client that the tip of said boot has been specifically developed as a sounding implement for tree inspection?

 

 

 

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[David Humphries]

Has anyone been on Mike Ellisons' 'Practitioners Guide to Visual Tree Assessment' workshops?

 

How did you find the section on interpretating & mapping decay ?

 

I haven't attended this myself but did see Mike demonstrate his skill with a hammer at a workshop on tree failure at Kew once.

 

I've heard that he went head to head with a decay detection device (not sure which one) & was more acurate.

Is this an urban arb myth or does anyone know anymore about this?

 

 

 

 

 

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[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Has anyone been on Mike Ellisons' 'Practitioners Guide to Visual Tree Assessment' workshops?

 

How did you find the section on interpretating & mapping decay ?

 

I haven't attended this myself but did see Mike demonstrate his skill with a hammer at a workshop on tree failure at Kew once.

 

I've heard that he went head to head with a decay detection device (not sure which one) & was more acurate.

Is this an urban arb myth or does anyone know anymore about this?

 

.

 

im sure he will thank you for perpetuating the myth!

 

like Sting said, that kind of publicity one can handle! (referring to the rumor he was a tantric stud muffin)

[David Humphries]

im sure he will thank you for perpetuating the myth!

 

I'm sure he would

 

 

shame this one didn't go any further...........or perhaps it did

 

Decay detection challenge?

 

.

[David Humphries]

Standard operating procedure here on almost any big old tree, thump 360 while inspecting dbh area and maybe the flare too..

 

Do you know when (& by whos lead/example) this became common place in North American arboriculture?

 

The earliest reference I could find.......

 

"The effectiveness of sounding as a preliminary evaluation

tool has been discussed (Boyce 1961), but no research

literature appears to address the subject with statistical rigor.

However, it is clear that sounding is a learned skill and its effectiveness

is therefore subject to the experience of the evaluator

and, in particular, his/her ability to adapt to the variability

introduced when evaluating different tree specimens,

including the bark thickness, trunk diameter, and amount of decay."

 

taken from a Mucciardi, Luley, and Gormally paper in Arboriculture & Urban Forestry

 

http://www.treeradar.com/pdf/Mucciardi_AUFSept2011.pdf

 

 

 

 

 

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[AA Teccie (Paul)]

Hi David, to add my ten penneth..

 

Whilst delivering the Basic Tree Surevy Course I explain about the 'nylon mallet' as a basic sounding device to detect decay / dysfunction but suggest it should be used in a targeted manner, rather than just randomnly 'knocking around', as it could still cause injury to lightly barked trees. That said I do acknowledge that not all examples of decay / dysfucntion exhibit visual signs.

 

Not sure what the guys in the vid were trying to establish, other than obvioulsy decay of course, but was that part of a safety inspection or pre-climb...wudda liked to have seen the ladders secured too...once a H&S nurdy always...

 

I have used the boot technique before too, but raised too many clients eyebrows so bought myself a mallet...much more impressive.

 

Hope you're well.

 

Cheers..

Paul

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Just had a quick search myself, found these while looking around and thought they was worth a download

 

 

http://www.forestry.gov.uk/pdf/fcpg13.pdf/$file/fcpg13.pdf

 

http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/fpl_pdfs/fpl_gtr147.pdf

 

http://joa.isa-arbor.com/request.asp?JournalID=1&ArticleID=3024&Type=2

 

http://www.onlinegardener.com/disease/Decay%20considerations%20in%20pruning.pdf