Woodfuel Chipper

[brasher]

Buzz -Well met the people buying the kit and they work across the country thats all I will say

 

This topics interesting and will deffinately be interesting to see how it pans out

Goodluck

 

Sawtooth, it seems to me that youre making assumptions rather than knowing the real workings and costings on this , The very operation that RJ is talking about is in fact subsidised as he stated in a different thread that he received DEFRA funding to set this up. If it had been a self funded operation and finance costs for machiery etc had been built in then would it have been such an attractive proposition? i think not. Fair play to RJ for going through the funding application , but it does imo seem a bit of a waste allocating funds to schemes like this where the people involved have very little knowledge about the field of work they are entering , and more so the people that are allocating the funding. I cant help thinking that if one had approached the bank with the same proposition the outcome would have been slightly different.

[Log-ologist]

I saw the tilhill brash baler working in Dorset about 6 years ago. According to the driver it was a trial effort. The brash and bales where full of soil and stones which blunted the chop saw in seconds. The only reason for having it was to remove the brash from sensitive heathland sites. It was an abject failiure. An expensive one at that.

[renewablejohn]

Sawtooth, it seems to me that youre making assumptions rather than knowing the real workings and costings on this , The very operation that RJ is talking about is in fact subsidised as he stated in a different thread that he received DEFRA funding to set this up. If it had been a self funded operation and finance costs for machiery etc had been built in then would it have been such an attractive proposition? i think not. Fair play to RJ for going through the funding application , but it does imo seem a bit of a waste allocating funds to schemes like this where the people involved have very little knowledge about the field of work they are entering , and more so the people that are allocating the funding. I cant help thinking that if one had approached the bank with the same proposition the outcome would have been slightly different.

 

Brasher

 

If you read the rules of the BEIS scheme you will see that all general plant and machinery costs are specifically excluded from the grant scheme.We secured grant for a wood pelleting plant and a woodchip drying plant.

[brasher]

Brasher

 

If you read the rules of the BEIS scheme you will see that all general plant and machinery costs are specifically excluded from the grant scheme.We secured grant for a wood pelleting plant and a woodchip drying plant.

 

Not how i read it RJ

[renewablejohn]

Not how i read it RJ

 

Brasher

 

Quite clear to me. Quote direct from the BEIS guidance notes.

 

Grants will not be provided for the following (the list is not exhaustive)

 

Standard items of equipment routinely used for purposes other than bio energy production. eg chainsaws, felling machines.forklifts, JCB's standard transport lorries etc.

[brasher]

Brasher

 

Quite clear to me. Quote direct from the BEIS guidance notes.

 

Grants will not be provided for the following (the list is not exhaustive)

 

Standard items of equipment routinely used for purposes other than bio energy production. eg chainsaws, felling machines.forklifts, JCB's standard transport lorries etc.

 

But chippers for producing biomass would be allowed?

[Buzz]

Brasher is quite correct. Many many guys have got grant funding for chippers. The key thing is you must have a direct end user. I for instance could not get a grant for a chipper and then aggregate chip i.e. sell it to various parties all over the country.

 

I apologize if i have come across as arrogant on this thread that was not my intention but i have been away and trying to type replies on my phone.

 

I have been involved in this sector of the industry for many years both directly through my own business and as a Contracts Manager for one of the biggest chip suppliers int he country.

 

The ONLY way to make wood chip from virgin timber work is either :

 

- In conjunction with a conventional harvesting system where by either a sky line or harvester forwarder brings the timber to roadside. Timber in the round is then left to dry and chipped to order.

 

- With a skyline system the brash is also bought to roadside where it can be chipped separately.

 

- On a conventional harvester forwarder site where the brash is left on the forest floor only brash that has not been used for brash mats can be extracted to roadside and chipped. Often the client is encouraged to leave bigger tops. This is increasingly common place due tot he fall in chip wood demand since just before Christmas.

 

- On clearance job whole trees are felled cut into sensible 20' or thereabouts lengths and extracted to roadside with a timber forwarder where is is stacked and chipped green. CHP plants such as Shotton will accept this material as the green levels are below 10-20%.

 

- On some clearance sites whole trees are felled and left on the ground for 2-4 weeks before extraction to let the needles drop off. It is then extracted and chipped.

 

I'm sorry renewable john but you will not make your plan work on brash, you simple will not get the production levels to make it pay.

If you are dead set on chipping in the woods then invest in a tractor trailer chip shuttle with a high tip trailer. Extract the chip to roadside and tip the trailer in to large hooklift bins on the forest roads. This is the method of choice in scandanavia although they still tend to chip at roadside.

 

Google ERJO or Bruks to see chip forwarders working in this way.

 

You have to get this right first time or you will fail and it will be an expensive game to re-kit with better equipment.

 

Only you know what your getting for your chip delivered in but i have a very good idea and you will not make it pay with your IBC bins.

 

I hope this is a little more constructive than my previous posts !!

[renewablejohn]

Brasher is quite correct. Many many guys have got grant funding for chippers. The key thing is you must have a direct end user. I for instance could not get a grant for a chipper and then aggregate chip i.e. sell it to various parties all over the country.

 

I apologize if i have come across as arrogant on this thread that was not my intention but i have been away and trying to type replies on my phone.

 

I have been involved in this sector of the industry for many years both directly through my own business and as a Contracts Manager for one of the biggest chip suppliers int he country.

 

The ONLY way to make wood chip from virgin timber work is either :

 

- In conjunction with a conventional harvesting system where by either a sky line or harvester forwarder brings the timber to roadside. Timber in the round is then left to dry and chipped to order.

 

- With a skyline system the brash is also bought to roadside where it can be chipped separately.

 

- On a conventional harvester forwarder site where the brash is left on the forest floor only brash that has not been used for brash mats can be extracted to roadside and chipped. Often the client is encouraged to leave bigger tops. This is increasingly common place due tot he fall in chip wood demand since just before Christmas.

 

- On clearance job whole trees are felled cut into sensible 20' or thereabouts lengths and extracted to roadside with a timber forwarder where is is stacked and chipped green. CHP plants such as Shotton will accept this material as the green levels are below 10-20%.

 

- On some clearance sites whole trees are felled and left on the ground for 2-4 weeks before extraction to let the needles drop off. It is then extracted and chipped.

 

I'm sorry renewable john but you will not make your plan work on brash, you simple will not get the production levels to make it pay.

If you are dead set on chipping in the woods then invest in a tractor trailer chip shuttle with a high tip trailer. Extract the chip to roadside and tip the trailer in to large hooklift bins on the forest roads. This is the method of choice in scandanavia although they still tend to chip at roadside.

 

Google ERJO or Bruks to see chip forwarders working in this way.

 

You have to get this right first time or you will fail and it will be an expensive game to re-kit with better equipment.

 

Only you know what your getting for your chip delivered in but i have a very good idea and you will not make it pay with your IBC bins.

 

I hope this is a little more constructive than my previous posts !!

 

Buzz

 

The advantage I have is that I am also the CHP operator therefore I do not play by the normal rules

[Mr Ed]

Buzz

 

The advantage I have is that I am also the CHP operator therefore I do not play by the normal rules

 

I'm still looking forward to seeing your CHP plant john, sounded very interesting.

I'm still not convinced you can get your chip to your plant for under £40 per tonne, which would buy you a lot of guarenteed chip supply...

[brasher]

I'm still looking forward to seeing your CHP plant john, sounded very interesting.

I'm still not convinced you can get your chip to your plant for under £40 per tonne, which would buy you a lot of guarenteed chip supply...

 

Agree with you on that one Ed , and i guess thats what people are trying to tell RJ--- people with considerably more insight ,not in a critical way , i hasten to add . I happen to know of one of the sites that is being considered, as people talk in this trade as in others , and its not one that i would want to take on using the methods described on an output basis ,because i know the outcome-- hence the comments.