Climbing self tend lowering? due to bad grounds people!

[Mesterh]

As Bob says if you HAVE to lower stuff your self because of bad groundstaff then sort them out!

 

If your on your own or are just getting a bit out the way while they are busy then fair enough.

[Danavan]

As Bob has said & yorself Mesterh sort em out.

 

I would like the time to & do if I work reg for some co's.

 

It is some times not possable when working with a new crew & the risk of my miss comication with a lack of experiance on their behalf (not that they wont be able to in time) that I have to lower for myself & direct crew into areas not yet found by them.

 

It just seems to me that in an industry that seems so wraped up in regs for climbers that an integeral part of the team should be looked away from. Imo a climber is only as good as his/her ground cerw.

 

Some times as a subi I HAVE to lower for my self because I have no choise if I want to earn the co £ & walk away not owing £ to the co's.

[Danavan]

there is an nptc course for 'groundying'.. i got it chucked in free when i did rigging course:thumbup:

 

I found that too. But I also found that the rigging course was aimed at climbers!

Alot of use to know how to rig from the ground when in the tree:confused1:

[Danavan]

for several branches, take several slings and carabinas up, take a bite of rope, tie the loose tail off on the stem near you in the tree, (or end of climbing line:blushing:) sling the branch, clip the crab into the bite, fig 8 or wrap the other end over/round a fork pulling slack through, cut and lower the branch, untie the loose end from round the stem and pull through.

you end up having to find the slings and crabs, at the end, but it works

make sence?

 

I Do the fig 8 attached to a strong point now & then for top outs. I find it lets it run enough befor I have the time to tend the line for myself without the classic death hold & shake your bones wrap/grip from others.

 

I like to use the wraps with end of line on smaller branches I have cut off as a friction point for small limbs too.

 

Sure none of this is nptc or hse reg, but get a recognition for the skill of the ground crew imo..

[ukminch]

If I was working with people I didn't feel were competent I'd like to think I'd be walking away from that particular job. Luckily I'm not not in that position, so don't know whether I would or not.

 

If they can't lower a branch what are your chances of rescue, or even managing to get help if the worst did happen.....

 

The fact that your lowering it yourself suggests that its on the smaller end of stuff being lowered. Sometimes it is easier to lower stuff yourself and the groundsman isn't required except to take it off. This is different to an incompetent groundsman.

 

The other thing that can really help is a quick chat before you go up the tree. If everybody knows a rough plan beforehand it can be so much easier than shouting about which pulley, how much slack etc etc when you can't communicate properly.

 

R

[Danavan]

If I was working with people I didn't feel were competent I'd like to think I'd be walking away from that particular job. Luckily I'm not not in that position, so don't know whether I would or not.

 

If they can't lower a branch what are your chances of rescue, or even managing to get help if the worst did happen.....

 

The fact that your lowering it yourself suggests that its on the smaller end of stuff being lowered. Sometimes it is easier to lower stuff yourself and the groundsman isn't required except to take it off. This is different to an incompetent groundsman.

 

The other thing that can really help is a quick chat before you go up the tree. If everybody knows a rough plan beforehand it can be so much easier than shouting about which pulley, how much slack etc etc when you can't communicate properly.

 

R

 

You are right on all points.

 

I still find myself doing to much even after comunication.

 

I find it easyer in some situations to take it on my self if I have had the expiriance of poor workmanship befor from people who just don't want to learn or have instruction because they have somehow been in the industry for a long time & think that is the way it should be done & I am a fool for wanting them to become more compitent in their job.

 

Walking away is an option but as you point out this is only the smaller scale of lowering. Lucky these co's don't get a lookin on the more tec jobs, prob due to the fact they are not in that league of tree work & clients can work this out quite well.

 

My point is that lowering is a skilled opperation & I feel some regulation to the required skill should be acnolaged, as this is often brushed under the ongoing supervision/ training onthe job trick tick insted of some investment in a true grounds persons value in our teams. After all climbers are required to go through lots of training ect to gain credit with bits of paper that tick boxs.

[ukminch]

Fair points, but no matter how many tickets you get, unfortunately people will still achieve them and be useless so probably a pointless excercise IMO.

 

I have several climbers that work for me. Some have all the tickets and are fantastic, other have turned up with all the tickets and are absolute rubbish, these don't get invited back for a second day! Others have the basic tickets but are also fantastic. Experience and attitude are what I'd prefer over everything else.

 

R

[Danavan]

Couldn't agree more.

 

Not the world the paper & laws live in though when things go wrong:thumbdown:

 

Training & right attitude is the way fwd imo. Hard to get the right combo all the time though..

Edited October 5, 2010 by Danavan

[Treegeek]

why would you not want to spend 10 mins going through stuff with the lads that ground for you

if it,s a proper lowering job and there groundies are not up to it

take one with you or tell em to get a grip or your not doing it

staff will never be good if you do not tell em:confused1:

 

Ditto

I'm not a lifer and am relativly a newbie to the experanced guys on here however i have had exeperiances with ground crew and rigging that have had me bail out and shout at guys twice my size (not braging) at the end of the day as bob says educate your crew and the next job you never know thay could have the capstan, rope, block all out sorted whilst you spike the victim ???

If thay are that inept then should you be doing the job with them on site ??? as staff can be a risk to trainnes etc

[Will Hinchliffe]

Sounds like you need to communicate better with the groundies Danavan. Make sure they know what you are doing, what your plan is for the tree. Control the site.

 

If they are really crap tell them. Sort them out.

 

Lowering your self is so undignified:lol: