Spindleshank fungus question?

[Steve Bullman]

I was sent this email today via the Arbtalk 'contact us' form. I'm unfamiliar with this fungus, so am posting the question on behalf of those concerned.

 

 

Hi, I am looking for info regarding a tree problem (including fungus) from someone who is an 'expert'. The problem concerns the felling of a tree (Red Oak opposite our house) and we are questioning the reasons for its demise. It was a beautiful tree without any obvious (to us and all neighbours) problems and the chopped-up wood and stump look virtually faultless - I have taken photos. We have been told by the tree surgeon who made the decision and carried out the felling that the presence of one small piece of Spindlshank (looked like a small mushroom) near the base of the tree, plus severe die-back (which we completely all dispute) meant that the root system would be in an advanced state of decay/damage making the tree dangerous.

 

My questions relate to the assertion that;

 

a) Once Spindleshank appears on the surface/ground near or on the tree, however small, alarm bells should ring as is it a clear sign that the root system has been extensively damaged already and the tree must be felled - no other options?

 

b) Red Oaks live up to around 70 years, or so we were told. This tree was estimated to be around 70 years old and therefore at the end of its life. Is 70 years its true life span - seems very short. The tree didn't look old - perhaps mature but not old, gnarled and sick.

 

c) If there had been extensive die-back ( which there was not!) would that not show in the wood, through the trunk and branches? The trunk was completely unblemished and the tree looked in great condition.

 

We are absolutely devastated to have lost this amazing tree which was stunning, especially in the summer and autumn and which we and all locals have admired for years. The tree was felled without any prior reference to us and by the time we saw what was happening it was virtually down. We are very angry and upset by what we suspect was a completely ridiculous decision. Is it possible for you to comment on the info i have provided especially the fungus 'problem'. Whilst we know that this is 'after the horse has bolted' we want to ensure that decisions concerning such significant trees on our estate are made in future by people whio know what they are doing and for the right reasons!

 

Regards

[Bundle 2]

One imagines that we are talking about Collybia fusipes?

 

Collybia fusipes - Google Search

 

This artice conserns the relationship with pedunculate oak.....

http://rparticle.web-p.cisti.nrc.ca/rparticle/AbstractTemplateServlet?calyLang=eng&journal=cjfr&volume=31&year=2001&issue=5&msno=x01-007

 

 

There was a whole thread about this started by Phenom about a year ago...have a search?

Edited January 18, 2010 by Bundle 2

[Bundle 2]

This is what Andy Summerly has to say about it in relation to the fungi rec' & response course...(Treelife ) Its hard to disagree with what little is said here...I hope it helps!

 

"Collybia fusipes • Sometimes confused with Armillaria • Decays roots and rarely extends above ground level • Specific type of decay remains unknown • Logically leads to loss of vigour and ultimately tree failure"

 

Gets cited in Strouts & Winter (pgs 220-221)and again with some id detail pg228....

Edited January 18, 2010 by Bundle 2

[Bundle 2]

A> I would take issue with such a statement of certainty....

 

B>Red oaks can, and commonly do, live to be considerably older than 70 years....Its somewhat subjective as a tree is the product of its environment, past & present. The wood is lousy however!

 

C>Maybe...maybe not!

 

Its a bit late in the day to do much about isnt it?

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

This sounds to me like a poor and knee jerk assesment, I havent seen the photos, and dont need to, the mans enqiury is clear consise and sounds about right, to not give cause to concern ourselves with the man not knowing enough about trees to be having a point of view.

 

Collybia fusipes can and does eat away at roots of oaks, and i know it can lead to failure, but the crown would be all but dead before it did fail, and it would probably have been felled long before a failure not for the pressence of the fungi, but because it just looked so poor.

 

it sounds to me that someone short of a little work over emphasised the threat in order to get some work, the tree could have and many oaks do, live with the fungi for many many years, decades and even longer.

[John Shutler]

took down this oak with spindleshank, the decay extended about 8ft up the stem, although the crown had poor form and displayed poor vigour(no more than than any other surpressed woodland oak), i was not prepared for the extent of decay i found, there was literally a pit below the stump

[Mark Cattell]

If the tree is felled and removed if the roots/but is still in situ, it should be easy to investigate the extent of root decay and condition to see if the work was required. if its a private tree with no protection then who are we to comment. also the proximitey to target ie roads other property also needs accounting for. An air spade and some investigatory work could have confirmed root decay issues.. have seen them fall apart into dust form the airspade whilst the tree had no visible sign of die back or decay.. some... Not all customers want the additional expense or the short trem liablity if the tree needs close monitoring for rapid decline then removing at futher or increased expense.. or the liability if it falls on peorsons or property

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

took down this oak with spindleshank, the decay extended about 8ft up the stem, although the crown had poor form and displayed poor vigour(no more than than any other surpressed woodland oak), i was not prepared for the extent of decay i found, there was literally a pit below the stump

 

you had spindle shank yes, but that wasnt working alone, you had a stem rotter there too

[John Shutler]

you had spindle shank yes, but that wasnt working alone, you had a stem rotter there too

 

no evidence of another pathogen, watched this tree for about 8 months prior to its removal

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

no evidence of another pathogen, watched this tree for about 8 months prior to its removal

 

IME, spindle shank wouldnt have got up the stem like that.

 

as ive said before, evidance I.e a fungal fruiting body, reqiures 2 compatable mycelium to have gotten into it for a sexual reproduction and "fruiting" to occcur. The fungus could be happily munching away for a decade or more before we have any idea!