Big Joe

The game is changing. Adapt, or die.

Re: Pruning Induced Stress Please explain: why does a shedding, generating organism need pruning by us? And why has Aberystwyth lost 80 trees of not less than 4m canopy spread between 2006 and 2010? Is it because narrow-minded ignorami like inexperienced little ole have me been up country too long and gone a bit Colonel Kurtz? Or is it because most people are so ignorant of and frightened by trees that well-meaning but naive and/or cynical 'tree surgeons' are trousering cash for work that doesn't need doing? Please tell me: perhaps too much beer is making me thick as well as fat, bald, old, ugly, a QPR fan, etc, etc... Experience? Go on: you first.

If it's bad: fell it. If it's good, LEAVE IT ALONE!

Sorry to crash this party late: prompted to drop in by David's UKTC post. Re: Pruning Induced Stress I just cannot believe how depressed it makes me feel to see that we're still even discussing this. Yes: lots of very impressive artistic work, paying the bills for many of us hard-working, decent people. However, how much was scientifically necessary? How many trees do we continue to degrade unnecessarily? If it REALLY needs pruning, have you got the right tree, in the right place, for the right reasons? Just think what we could quote for a take-down and replant?! If you doubt me, you MUST receive VTA training that includes David's "Pruned to Death?" presentation. Utterly compelling. To begin with, may I refer any sceptics to Shigo, Lonsdale, Mattheck and the new BS 3998. Pruning = damage. Trees never heal. Humans may benefit as a result of tree pruning, but only sometimes... In my job, I continue to see dreadful work, and many totally unnecessary surgical interventions. The general public continue to refuse to believe that pruning isn't the answer: "don't get me wrong - we love trees. Why can't you just cut half off, like that one over there?" I fear our grandchildren may think of us like we think of Tudor surgeons and Victorian chimney sweeps. "Good heavens, Grandpa! Did you really climb trees on a rope with a fossil fuel chainsaw and cut big bits off? Why?" Beer is the answer. Peace; out.

Hey, Man! Don't shoot the H&S guy: he's someone's son, too. Educate him!

Cheers, Blazer! I, too, survived a childhood mucking about in the outdoors. I ate (amongst other things) bluebells, cow parsley, and loved the bitter taste of beech leaves. I did not enjoy the asparagus root I once tried. But it didn't kill me. Neither did the raw milk, straight from the cow. For those with any remaining interest in the topic, there's some good stuff (for once - amongst the usual off-thread rubbish) on UKTC, and some truly outstanding stuff on the QTRA Users (ie not public) Discussion List. I've had responses from both Helliwell and Lonsdale - a bright note on which to finish an otherwise dreary week! Peace: out!

Hello Forum My colleagues and I have been working with our schools to promote ecological learning. Many schools, particularly Primaries, now have Forest Schools, often featuring newly planted small woodlands and hedges with an emphasis on native species, thus including Privet, Spindle, Rowan, Holly and Wayfaring Tree. Our colleague in the H&S team advising schools is recommending that Holly is removed from all primaries, as the only text he can refer to is MAFF's 'Poisonous Plants & Fungi' (HMSO 1988), in which pretty much everything is 'poisonous' and 'potentially lethal'. We feel very strongly that to systematically remove all Holly (and potentially everything else described in his book as poisonous!) is very poor risk management, being grossly disproportionate to the risk. Rather like poor old Saddam, we are finding it difficult to prove a negative: there is no solid data on toxicity and incidences of poisoning by plants, we suspect because it quite simply never occurs. Our case is that, whilst a goat might chew enough Holly berries to receive a toxic dose of glycosides, no child is ever likely to because it is not palateable. Berry in, chew, immediately spit out? Does anyone have any suggestions for sources of information on this subject? To date, I have researched HSE stats, the Institute of Biomedical Science, the Royal College of Pathology and Royal College of General Practitioners. None of these have any information, opinion or advice to offer, other than HSE advice to try the HPA. I have bought Gillan's 'Poisonous Plants' and we have Kew's CD-ROM 'Poisonous Plants & Fungi' on order. I have found an HPA/NPIS leaflet on "Low Toxicity Substances" which includes Holly. The NPIS is proving elusive, but I do now have a phone number for their equivalent in Wales, via the Public Health Board. Our H&S colleague is not an unreasonable man, and has a difficult job to do. We agree that Laburnum and Cherry Laurel are not appropriate planting in Primary School settings. We need to support him in unearthing better guidance than he is currently using, so that children can safely learn about native plants and risk assessment. Any help will be very much appreciated! Best wishes

Thanks, Slim! Could have gone to UKTC for that !! Cheers

My mate Carps is suddenly allergic to something. Reaction is worst at home, particularly his bedroom, poor chap. Itchy rash, and the quack has him on 12 pills and carrying an epi-pen. The first flare up immediately followed some carpentry on Oak boards he's been air-drying for 18 years. They had a black, sooty mould on them. I'm wondering if that might be some kind of ergot? Does anyone have any ideas or similar tales? Any help much appreciated. Cheers!

Ignore me; I'm a cynical old bastard. Grumpy Old Man at 43! Never thought I'd live this long. Seriously: I'm very lucky. I work with trees and I LOVE it. Wouldn't change a thing. £13/tonne was split with Keith, so £6.50/tonne each. Aimed for 15 a day between us: never made quite enough. But, by Christ, I was ripped to the tits. Out before dawn, back after dusk. Half a tonne of brash in the plughole after my bath, eat everything in the house, drink like a Viking, asleep by 8.30 latest. Happy Days!

Shortwooding at £13/tonne was hard, pruning Xmas trees pretty horrible, managing Sitka plantations to help the rich limit their taxable liabilities very grim, Variations on Utility contract across England & Wales just hideous, but the toughest by far is Council Arb Officer: several reminders every day of just how ignorant of trees the general public truly are...

Feared as much. Thank you, Gerrit!

The main doc is available as a free .pdf. Download from FC website: library, publications, or link here - http://www.forestry.gov.uk/PDF/FCMS024.pdf/$FILE/FCMS024.pdf

Impressive crop on A saccharinum, exhibiting severe distress. Can anyone ID this for me? Cheers

Friendliest arb site with a well-moderated and friendly atmosphere. If people ever ask me where to look for general tree advice, I always suggest Arbtalk. Good site. Great work, and please keep it up.