Muscles and Movement

[softbankhawks]

Continuing from the Hitch Hiker thread....I asked Old Mill to write more about 'slack tending'....he wrote this:

The typical method for HC Pulley climbers on DdRT is to pull down on the rope above the pulley with one hand whilst the other hand simultaneously pulls the slack through the pulley.

But if one pulls down towards the feet, the Pulley is drawn down and slack remains in the system creating an amount of sit back. If one pulls the rope upwards and away from the body, the pulley is held up whilst slack is tended through hitch and pulley allowing very little or no sit back.

It is this action of pulling the rope upwards that I refer to. The bicep muscle amongst others are used and while it does work, the tighter ones hitch the greater the effort and ones fatigue level.

The exact same technique is used for the RW HC combo on SRWP.

 

To tend the Hitch Hiker, one hand pulls down on the rope below the HH whilst the other hand slides the HH up the rope. The effort required to slide the HH up the rope ranges from minimal if you prefer a tighter hitch, to zero if you prefer a loose hitch. The sliding is done close to the body rather than at arms length therefore ergonomically better due to less effort involved.

Also, if you happen to be on the Pantin, sliding the HH up is a one handed job.

[softbankhawks]

This describes vertical or near vertical movement?

With the hitch hiker in ddrt set-up?

I dont see a difference in the hitch climber or HH. You can do the same thing with both?? A tight or loose hitch means the same thing on either?

[Ewan Murray]

Yeah i agree i think the main issue with slack tending being tiring is the length of the bridge if your slack tending device is higher up you will have to pull more in order to advance the hitch, i find that sometimes its easier to use two hands if you can balance on the limb and just keep pulling with quick hands works a treat.

[Old Mill Tree Care]

I was referring to the HH in SRT use.

 

I'll put a video on here later and you can see the HH advancement.

 

Yes you can advance both devices the same but sliding it up is easier with the HH.

DMc described this somewhere more eloquently than I did. Hopefully he can shed more light.

 

Have you used a HH and HC?

 

What's your point anyway?

 

 

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Edited February 12, 2013 by Old Mill Tree Care

[Adam Bourne]

There's no ergonomic difference between slack tending from a limb walk Ddrt or Srt, the fact that every other device uses a pulley (except the uni and hitchhiker) is infact the only difference, using a pulley is automatically going to feel smoother as there is hardly any friction if any, using a device such as the uni and HH which had no pulley just adds that little more friction coming from the straight edges of the uni and the bina on the HH, there for requiring a little more effort to tend slack. I really don't see an issue with this having briefly spent a few minutes on Dan Curtis unicender and playing with the slack tending on the floor I felt no extra effort doing it with say a hitch that had tightened up and regardless of a pulley being there or not still required more energy to tend the slack.

[softbankhawks]

Adam said it, the differences are negligable, those that know me on here can vouch that I've climbed with everything, the differences are negligable and my point was that 'slack tending'....movement...has more to do with a body to tree connection than finding the 'sweetest' technical 'bridge' between our body and the tree. Your sentence....ergonomic slack tending sounded so funny, it made me realise how we as climbers miss the bigger point and stare at our navels through gear chat and minor hardware developments. Sorry dude, fire one back at me.....x

[Old Mill Tree Care]

Adam, you miss my point. Yes there is more friction slack tending the HH or Uni if you pull rope through and use an upward motion.

My point is I DON'T use an upward motion, I slide the HH up the rope.

I'm not talking about DdRT.

That's all.

 

 

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[Adam Bourne]

Adam, you miss my point. Yes there is more friction slack tending the HH or Uni if you pull rope through and use an upward motion.

My point is I DON'T use an upward motion, I slide the HH up the rope.

I'm not talking about DdRT.

That's all.

 

 

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Sorry mate but I wasn't missing your point at all, the fact that even the slightest bit of friction is added with these 2 devises through lack of pulley is erelevant, what I'm simply saying is there's more friction in a hitch and pulley when the hitch is either been dressed and set to tightly causing it to bite there for regardless of the setup having a pulley the friction is coming from the hitch, its personnel preference in what your saying Ie: 2 different people tending slack in different ways! When I used the uni it tended slack just as easy and smooth as a well set hitch and pulley combo, for the reson being once all the gates on the uni close the rope is completely free and the only friction would be to come from the straight edges of the uni plates, having not used a HH yet I can't really comment but I bet my bottom dolla the friction is no more than my rope wrench setup on a hitch and hitchclimber pulley, in the HH thread yesterday I asked if anyone had tried or if it would be possible to add a dmm pinto spacer it reduce this small amount of added slack tending friction but after reading all this I'm not sure if it would warrant even adding one as I can see now the friction is only going to come from the hitch its self whilst slack tending on a limb walk, I see the way you do it coming in handy but its about doing things what feels natural to you.

[Adam Bourne]

Adam said it, the differences are negligable, those that know me on here can vouch that I've climbed with everything, the differences are negligable and my point was that 'slack tending'....movement...has more to do with a body to tree connection than finding the 'sweetest' technical 'bridge' between our body and the tree. Your sentence....ergonomic slack tending sounded so funny, it made me realise how we as climbers miss the bigger point and stare at our navels through gear chat and minor hardware developments. Sorry dude, fire one back at me.....x

 

No mate I'm with you all the way on that one maybe we do look to far into things

[Dan Curtis]

unicender and playing with the slack tending on the floor I felt no extra effort doing it with say a hitch that had tightened up and regardless of a pulley being there or not still required more energy to tend the slack.

 

There is an easier way with the uni than tending pulley style, with a bit of tail weight you can lift it from the bottom, and it'll self tail. Imo, easier than pulley style tending