Meripulus on London plane,

[thorn]

Hi

 

Does anyone out there have any experience of Meripulus on london plane I sort of instinctively dont feel as concerned as if it was on beech in a similar setting (in a high target public park). My understanding is that plane respond better than ash when infected with inonotus . I wondered if it had a similar relaitionship with meripulus. It is in the early stages of infection this is the first year I have seen the fruiting bodies. But I did fell a beech a couple of years ago 90 yards away with meripulus. Next step I feel is to air spade round the affected buttress and resistograph that baby . Any thoughts:thumbup1:

[David Humphries]

Hi

 

Does anyone out there have any experience of Meripulus on london plane I sort of instinctively dont feel as concerned as if it was on beech in a similar setting (in a high target public park). My understanding is that plane respond better than ash when infected with inonotus . I wondered if it had a similar relaitionship with meripulus. It is in the early stages of infection this is the first year I have seen the fruiting bodies. But I did fell a beech a couple of years ago 90 yards away with meripulus. Next step I feel is to air spade round the affected buttress and resistograph that baby . Any thoughts:thumbup1:

 

 

Hello Thorn

I've seen LA's fell roadside planes with Meripilus, but not sure they were ever inspected with decay detection equipment.

If you have access to these, then it's a no brainier isn't it?

 

How far around the circumference is it currently fruiting?

 

I'm managing beech and maple with Meripilus but not plane, so no personal experience of that specific interaction.

But like you, I would feel that a (vascularly healthy) plane would potentially cope with Meripilus better than other tree species.

 

 

.

[treeseer]

Hello Thorn

I've seen LA's fell roadside planes with Meripilus, but not sure they were ever inspected with decay detection equipment.

If you have access to these, then it's a no brainier isn't it?

.

Access to a mallet may be enough; see Schwarze 2008, acoustic testing can give reliable results.

 

No mention of Merip on plane in either book i could find; speaks to plane's extraordinary resistance.

[David Humphries]

Access to a mallet may be enough; see Schwarze 2008, acoustic testing can give reliable results.

 

No mention of Merip on plane in either book i could find; speaks to plane's extraordinary resistance.

 

Agreed Guy, but depending on level of target, it may be prudent to obtain a more indepth & visual record of inspection.

 

I've noted Meripilus on plane over the last couple of years seemingly becoming more prevelant.

Perhaps increase in urban stress may play a part.

 

Tbh, i'm not entirely sure if this one below is still there, (It's a neighbouring LA's) will have to go back and check.

 

 

.

[thorn]

Hi

 

To answer both points raised , I have already sounded it with a mallet as a matter of course , I have also micro hammered it and compared it against another healthy plane to cross reference the results , they where both high readings the healthy tree being in the 1300s' and the infected one 1200+ , But this is only testing the stem in one plane (as in direction of sound wave not tree species name) and traditionally my understanding is meripulus affects the underside of roots. Hence the intention to air spade and resistograph , these trees are roughly 120/140ish years old circumference is getting on for five metres dia at stem base where I micro hammered is getting on for 130cm they are big old sticks. Interestingly there are two sites on the stem with fruiting bodies virtually directly opposite each other at one point the fruiting body is in the usual position of stem base / soil interface. On the other side of the stem the bracket comes straight out of the stem at 30cm . I will sort out some photos when I get a chance thanks for all your useful observations and comments I'm much obliged.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Hi

 

To answer both points raised , I have already sounded it with a mallet as a matter of course , I have also micro hammered it and compared it against another healthy plane to cross reference the results , they where both high readings the healthy tree being in the 1300s' and the infected one 1200+ , But this is only testing the stem in one plane (as in direction of sound wave not tree species name) and traditionally my understanding is meripulus affects the underside of roots. Hence the intention to air spade and resistograph , these trees are roughly 120/140ish years old circumference is getting on for five metres dia at stem base where I micro hammered is getting on for 130cm they are big old sticks. Interestingly there are two sites on the stem with fruiting bodies virtually directly opposite each other at one point the fruiting body is in the usual position of stem base / soil interface. On the other side of the stem the bracket comes straight out of the stem at 30cm . I will sort out some photos when I get a chance thanks for all your useful observations and comments I'm much obliged.

 

A dificult fungi to asses with any level of certainty, the airspade is about the only way of getting a true handle on progress. Matthecks cone method should help giving ideas as to where roots NEED to be. Though root morphology is not as cut and dry as this, most trees once mature will have a cone of decay in the basal region and associated levels of decay in the attached old woody roots. meripilus is one of those that can feed from these older tissues for many decades before progressing to the more dangerous mode of degrading the shear killing fine root system.

 

It is really this action of dissolving shear killing roots that is the danger with Meripilus colonisation. if we have shear kill roots we have no problem, if we dont, we have a big problem. So IMO it is these shear killing roots we should attempt to locate, and most basal investigations I've seen done have been at the very stem base, where very little worthwhile knowledge on the mechanics can be gained as to the true extent of this particular interaction.

 

The other flip side of the coin is the potential for loosening of the shear root ball during such investigations, retaining trees with Meripilus is what I would regard as the most tricky of all the fungi interactions, a very challenging area. One needs a VERY solid understanding of mechanics, decay modes and aging tree morphology to fully understand and give a worthy prognosis to each case.

 

All the evaluation tools picus, resist-o-graph, root radar have little to offer in these investigations, and may as well be left in their box!

 

root radar will pick up the sound upper half of the horseshoe form of the roots but not the shear killers, resist-o-graph will go through the upper wall of the root and then feel no resistance as it is the underside that is gone, this isnt the problem, and it doesn't tell you anything about the re iterative roots coming off as shear kills from the occluding tissues associated with the decaying undersides. and Picus, well that is a butt evaluation tool and we all know butt rot is too low to be read with Picus in Meripilus cases dont we.

[David Humphries]

Hi, traditionally my understanding is meripulus affects the underside of roots. Hence the intention to air spade and resistograph.

 

I recall some research at Alice Holt where Meripilus was investigated in the base and up into trunks (on beech), so not entirely sure that the roots are the only target area whilst assessing for decay and associated implication of Meripilus.

 

Having said that, I've not picked up on any stem failures in reports or literature citing Meripilus,

but I think it prudent to not stay boxed in regarding colinisation strategy.

 

 

 

.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

I recall some research at Alice Holt where Meripilus was investigated in the base and up into trunks (on beech), so not entirely sure that the roots are the only target area whilst assessing for decay and associated implication of Meripilus.

 

Having said that, I've not picked up on any stem failures in reports or literature citing Meripilus,

but I think it prudent to not stay boxed in regarding colinisation strategy.

 

 

 

.

 

 

agreed, but a very very rare situation indeed.

 

I dont know if I updated it yet but what i thought was Meripilus at height turned out to be Polyporus durus, so shall not assume too much at height in future, got to get up there every time to be sure.

[David Humphries]

 

I dont know if I updated it yet but what i thought was Meripilus at height turned out to be Polyporus durus, so shall not assume too much at height in future, got to get up there every time to be sure.

 

That's interesting

 

 

 

 

.

[treeseer]

" Matthecks cone method should help giving ideas as to where roots NEED to be. Though root morphology is not as cut and dry as this, most trees once mature will have a cone of decay in the basal region and associated levels of decay in the attached old woody roots. meripilus is one of those that can feed from these older tissues for many decades"

 

ok i'm with you so far.

 

" before progressing to the more dangerous mode of degrading the shear killing fine root system."

 

These are the adventitious roots that developed at the edges where decay in the primary roots stopped, yes? And these secondary roots "kill" movements that would shear tissues apart, hence "shear killing"? I'm behind, sorry.

 

"It is really this action of dissolving shear killing roots that is the danger with Meripilus colonisation. if we have shear kill roots we have no problem, if we dont, we have a big problem. So IMO it is these shear killing roots we should attempt to locate"

 

Like the one in the image with the calipers?

 

", and most basal investigations I've seen done have been at the very stem base, where very little worthwhile knowledge on the mechanics can be gained as to the true extent of this particular interaction."

 

or many others; gotta dig deeper for info.

 

"The other flip side of the coin is the potential for loosening of the shear root ball during such investigations,"

 

We generally use a coarse, porous aggregate like lava or expanded slate and compact it. But often there are pruning or support works above that make toppling less likely.

 

" retaining trees with Meripilus is what I would regard as the most tricky of all the fungi interactions, a very challenging area. One needs a VERY solid understanding of mechanics, decay modes and aging tree morphology to fully understand and give a worthy prognosis to each case.

All the evaluation tools picus, resist-o-graph, root radar have little to offer in these investigations, and may as well be left in their box!"

 

Like trapeze work with no net!

 

"root radar will pick up the sound upper half of the horseshoe form of the roots but not the shear killers, resist-o-graph will go through the upper wall of the root and then feel no resistance as it is the underside that is gone, this isnt the problem,"

 

VERY WELL PUT.

 

"and it doesn't tell you anything about the re iterative roots coming off as shear kills from the occluding tissues associated with the decaying undersides."

 

Ah okay, reiterations, yes, that's exactly what we saw on q alba. the root was covered up and is scheduled for annual measurement.

 

"Picus, well that is a butt evaluation tool and we all know butt rot is too low to be read with Picus in Meripilus cases dont we"

 

Yes gotta dig deeper for info. Hand tools work but take a bit more time. thank you for a marvelous post!