keptenjim

Just standard Stihl chain oil

Apologies everybody - I got severely side-tracked. Well I did what I said I was going to do and that is buy a new pump and fit it. I started the machine and got the same result - no change! So an arborist friend suggested I take it to somebody in our area who "knows his chainsaws." He ran the saw and also cut some wood with it and checked the oil situation after that and concluded that the amount of oil  coming from the saw was no more than he would expect. He said the chainsaw is running normally. 

So there you have it. Before the chain derailed, there is no way it chucked oil over my boots and clothes as it does now. Maybe its got something to do with the fact that lately I have been running it for the purpose of checking it without cutting wood. I'll see how it does next time I use it.

Many thanks for the input I got

This afternoon I will change the pump outlet seal with a new one, as Spudulike suggested, then I'll run the saw. If it still leaks, then obviously the pump is damaged and I'll replace it. Thanks to all for your help and advice. 

On 13/05/2022 at 19:55, carlos said:

did you say you changed the bar? could the oil holes on the bar be in the wrong place?

Yes, the bar was changed for a brand new one, the same as the original one. The original one got damaged when the chain derailed

On 08/05/2022 at 22:34, spudulike said:

Take the pump off and check there is a rubber round seal between the pump output and the oil channel input. My money is on it missing, damaged or split. 

The pump looks too new to be faulty unless it has been damaged somehow. I don't suppose you have had the crank seal changed recently? It needs to be flush otherwise it doesn't allow the pump to sit flat but generally stops the pinion spinning freely.

Still a strange one for a fresh looking saw!

The rubber seal looks ok to me, or should I take it out of it's housing and inspect it? The crank seal hasn't been changed lately 

On 02/05/2022 at 19:39, spudulike said:

If the bar is fully clamped against the bar mount and the bar is correct for the machine, oil can't escape between the bar and the mount.

I have seen old pumps leak from where the pump gear shaft enters the pump but that is from wear on the shaft so is unlikely on a near new machine. 

I guess you could seal the oil channel with a piece of paper/card clamped between the bar and mount to see if you still get oil pissing out. Run the chain semi loose and don't cut wood with it though, just rev it a bit. If it still pisses out, it isn't the mount that is an issue.

This one is a bit weird!

If this doesn't help, perhaps take the pump off and check for the seals on pump inlet and outlet.

 

Finally managed to get this done. I tried what you suggested and blanked out the oil channel using a piece of cardboard and then mounted the bar and made it nice and tight. I ran it in the manner you suggested and sure enough, oil was pissing out. So, I stripped it down and found that although the cardboard was still in place, there was evidence of oil having flowed down from the oil channel. Perhaps after the run, there was a residual pressure in the oil channel which equalised when I removed the bar and caused a bit of oil to squirt out around the cardboard? However, as you can see, there was also quite a lot of oil in the pump compartment. I’m thinking, maybe its time to fit a new oil pump and be done with it?

13 hours ago, spudulike said:

If the bar is fully clamped against the bar mount and the bar is correct for the machine, oil can't escape between the bar and the mount.

I have seen old pumps leak from where the pump gear shaft enters the pump but that is from wear on the shaft so is unlikely on a near new machine. 

I guess you could seal the oil channel with a piece of paper/card clamped between the bar and mount to see if you still get oil pissing out. Run the chain semi loose and don't cut wood with it though, just rev it a bit. If it still pisses out, it isn't the mount that is an issue.

This one is a bit weird!

If this doesn't help, perhaps take the pump off and check for the seals on pump inlet and outlet.

 

Thanks, I'll try this and let you know - John 

3 minutes ago, spudulike said:

BTW - you do know your bar plate is missing....don't you.

This thing....

Inner Side Plate 0.9 mm for Stihl MS440, MS460 Chainsaws - 1128 664 1001 | L&S Engineers

WWW.LSENGINEERS.CO.UK

---

Inner Side Plate 0.9 mm for Stihl MS440, MS460 Chainsaws Genuine Stihl Part OEM Part No. 1128 664 1001 Suitable for...

 

Yes I took the side plate off to enable you to check for damage in the casing underneath. Also, I only run the chainsaw with the chain tensioned and the bar firmly tightened up to the bar mount

On 26/04/2022 at 17:57, spudulike said:

One other suggestion, spray WD40 in to the oiling hole to the back of the oiling channel whilst plugging the gap around it. Do this and check for leakage from damage ....it is possible the loose e clip has cracked or damaged something.

There is a small rubber sealing ring joining the pump to the oiling channel feed. If this is missing or is damaged, the oil will do what you have .

 

I did what you suggested re the WD40 trick although I don't know how successfully I covered the gaps! But I didn't see any leaking fluid. I cleaned it out and gave it a close inspection with my untrained eye but didn't see any damage. I then reassembled it and ran it and ended up with oil pouring out as before. So I quickly disassembled it again and tried to see where the oil was coming from and I get the impression that it's running down mainly from the oil delivery channel. I am now wondering if the metering system whereby the rate of oil delivery to the chain can be adjusted, is perhaps damaged, and the pump is now delivering too much oil up to the chain?

Cheers Spudulike - many thanks for this info. I'll work on it tomorrow and let you know what I come up with. Thanks again 

I agree with you - I don't know what happened there. The second time I tensioned the chain, I paid close attention to what I was doing. In retrospect I should have looked under the chain cover after the first mis-start. But that's another story - right now I'm trying to get to get to the bottom of the oil pools 

Don't think so Stubby - looks damage-free as far as I can see 

I recently needed to use my MS661, so I filled it with Aspen 2 and chain oil and tensioned the chain. I started it and almost immediately noticed that the chain was loose. I re-tensioned the chain and then restarted the chain saw. Again it loosened and then came right off the bar. I switched it off immediately and removed the chain cover and saw that the ‘E’ clip that retains the chain sprocket was missing. I also noticed that the bar was damaged when the chain came off. I replaced the bar and the chain with new ones, fitted a new ‘E’ clip and started it again. It’s now running well but after use where it’s been sitting on the ground, leaves pools of chain oil below it. It seems to be leaking this oil only during and after running and not when sitting unused. Can anyone advise what might be the problem?

Well that does it then - the trees stay as they are and the hedge gets planted between them. Thanks to all for feedback

Thanks for the advice given. But quite honestly, I'll probably be pushing up daisies by the time I've coppiced everything and then waited for the regrowth then laid a new hedge. No, no, I simply want to cut all that growth down to about 8 feet or thereabouts (see pics) and plant new hedge in the gaps. What I'm asking is 'if I do this will those trees shown in the photo survive such radical cutback and will they grow to help form the structure of a hedge'? If someone could help me with those questions I could then decide if it will be a worthwhile project 

18 hours ago, AJStrees said:

I would agree with woody on that concept. Behind the fence, keep some hedgerow trees, the better condition and better for biodiversity types such as oak, etc.... So you have a hedgerow with hedgerow trees in it, in years to come it will be a thing of beauty. 

Those hedgerow trees you mention, would you initially cut them down to the 6 - 8 feet that I'm considering so they would actually become part of the hedge? And is there a risk that they could die if cutting them back radically? Also, is there a 'best' time of year to cut them back in the manner I'm planning? 

Could someone please give me advice for creating a hedge along the boundary of a field? What I have there at the moment are some mainly self-seeded ash, chestnut, oak, hazel and various other stragglers. My plan is to cut all these down to about 6 - 8 feet and then fill the in-between spaces with new hazel. My questions are; would the existing trees handle such a radical cut back. Also, what would be the best time of year to carry out this operation? Any more advice would be much appreciated 

On 14/06/2021 at 10:29, agg221 said:

Slightly OT but if you are planning on keeping it, I would be looking very seriously at that low angle fork which is effectively creating twin leaders and removing one of them.

 

Midsummer is the right time to prune walnuts so I would be doing it about now (I have some formative pruning to do on my own).

Alec

Thanks for that - I'll take your advice and remove one of the main branches at the fork. Cheers - Jim

On 05/06/2021 at 21:35, Paul in the woods said:

If you want to confirm the id the leaves should have a fairly strong smell when rubbed. Sort of pine/citrus scent.

Just seen your post - been offline for about a week. Yes, the leaves do have that scent you describe. Good tip, many thanks 

Thanks guys - walnut then

Could someone please ident this tree - thanks

Sorry, photos are not very good. Two trees - I only have one photo of the red-leafed tree. Thanks 

1 hour ago, Derek Eames said:

Very interesting. More photos needed but maybe a species of Juglans but agree the leaf looks like Beech although the stem base in unusual.trees 

Location, Harting Down National Trust. There's a grove of these trees

The leaves of this ancient looking tree remind me of a silver birch. But probably not? 

16 hours ago, AA Teccie (Paul) said:

Option 1 = retain and do nothing (...and find something else to watch when it's windy, not meaning to be flippant here but I really do understand your concerns when watching trees do in storms what they need to survive...and it's had a serious bashing recently and it's still there, seemingly in tact)

Option 2 = retain and remove only dead / broken branches (doubtless resultant from the storm they'll be present)

Option 3 = remove (particularly if you're considering a heavy reduction as Poplars don't do well with big pruning cuts and will need ongoing maintenance)

 

Obviously the latter option needs very serious consideration because of environmental and wildlife etc. impacts...and check for any Council / Planning restrictions etc.

 

"Just my ten-penneth, I'm sure others will have more / different."

 

Regards,
Paul

Thanks for the advice Paul - since it seems to manage in the storms I'll do as you suggest and leave it alone 

Thanks