Turkey oak decay

[stevelucocq]

Been to see a large Turkey oak with what appears to have small patches of ustlina? Around a third of the buttress and lower trunk appears to be softly decayed to a depth of around 50mm on the tension side of the lean. Unsure what’s happening beyond that.

 

Also any comments/observation are welcome.

 

Thanks

[David Humphries]

Steve I personally can't see anything in the shots that looks like Kretzschmaria/Ustulina fruit bodies or the associated decay.

 

The sapwood dysfunction does look like the type of decay I have seen associated with the saprotrophic activity of species like Hypholma fasiculare

 

Although that's just conjecture with out a fuller history.

 

If it is then I would be keen to look at the butresses and associated roots directly below.

 

 

Just my thoughts.

 

 

Looking again, the dysfunctional tracts appear to be in the depressions/sinuses either side of the buttress, so there may be no associated dysfunction with that root attached to that buttress?

 

 

.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

turkey oaks are very poor once decay is colonising volumes, looks more like armillaria decay to me which also ties in with the bacterial wetwood stain above, or what appears to be so.

 

just an opinion however, and based on very limited material

[stevelucocq]

Thanks for the replies.

 

Sorry for the limited info on this one but was pushed for time and the heavens opened.

 

Initially I thought honey fungus but no boot laces where to be found under the bark? Then I noticed small areas of charcoal like substances in between the creases in the bark. It appeared just like ustilina but I also thought it could be bleeding. All made a little bit more difficult as the whole tree was drenched.

 

Yes we lost a big turkey oak this week, see attached, failed at root plate in last Saturdays storm.

[stevelucocq]

Steve I personally can't see anything in the shots that looks like Kretzschmaria/Ustulina fruit bodies or the associated decay.

 

The sapwood dysfunction does look like the type of decay I have seen associated with the saprotrophic activity of species like Hypholma fasiculare

 

Although that's just conjecture with out a fuller history.

 

If it is then I would be keen to look at the butresses and associated roots directly below.

 

 

Just my thoughts.

 

 

Looking again, the dysfunctional tracts appear to be in the depressions/sinuses either side of the buttress, so there may be no associated dysfunction with that root attached to that buttress?

 

 

.

 

Dysfunctional area covers the back third of the tree. Appeared no difference in between the buttresses and roots attached to buttress?

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

an absence of bootlaces does not indicate an absence of armillaria in my experience.

 

the Oak failure was pure load and loss of shear strength in the soil probably due to heavy rain.

[stevelucocq]

an absence of bootlaces does not indicate an absence of armillaria in my experience.

 

the Oak failure was pure load and loss of shear strength in the soil probably due to heavy rain.

 

Thanks, What is throwing me is the black charcoal substance between the bark creases. I Did not know if this something others had come across on turkey oak with ustilina as I have not noticed this relationship before? I will nip back when dry with a better camera.

 

 

I have had limited experience of the early stages of armillaria , no doubt its been right there in front if my face but guess I have missed on some tell tale signs. I think I remember some info about bleeds and callus growth which can indicate armillaria infection? So I am guessing but it may be just bleed from the early initial infection from armillaria?

 

Yeap sorry for the tangent but included the failed turkey oak for interest as apposed to any fungal decay reasons. I guess I should have started a new thread for that one.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Thanks, What is throwing me is the black charcoal substance between the bark creases. I Did not know if this something others had come across on turkey oak with ustilina as I have not noticed this relationship before? I will nip back when dry with a better camera.

 

 

I have had limited experience of the early stages of armillaria , no doubt its been right there in front if my face but guess I have missed on some tell tale signs. I think I remember some info about bleeds and callus growth which can indicate armillaria infection? So I am guessing but it may be just bleed from the early initial infection from armillaria?

 

Yeap sorry for the tangent but included the failed turkey oak for interest as apposed to any fungal decay reasons. I guess I should have started a new thread for that one.

 

It is stated in the lit that Kretz can cause bleeding, I actually doubt that these days, preferring the secondary agent of armillaria for the causal agent of those typical brown bleeds.

 

As for the Kretz, oaks do get Kretz so not at all ruling it out, and often armillaria is in most Kretz cases I see also present. It isnt clear or at least no one has clarified the parasitic/saprobic/necrotrophic nature of K duesta, from my limited experience it is largely if not entirely saprobic.

 

No need to apologis for the Oak failure, alls good:001_cool:

 

heres a kretz failure I spotted today, no indication at ground level, heavy colonisation via heart woods and heavy fruiting at around 6 metres between inclusions, even the best assessor would have been oblivious.

 

Kretz is a tricky critter at times:thumbdown:

 

 

[stevelucocq]

Went back today. A bit easier to spot the bleeding in the dry. See attached pictures. So i guess it maybe early Armillaria?

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Went back today. A bit easier to spot the bleeding in the dry. See attached pictures. So i guess it maybe early Armillaria?

 

yep thats definitely:001_smile: got that honey whiff about it!