Re-pollard of ancient Willow

[treeseer]

"Whatever method used,

 

I must prefer the method that promotes the tree's growth of callus tissue, and self-optimization. this can occur along with hollows; no contradictions there.

 

"if you do it right, you may be rewarded by an ectomycorrhizal symbiont, such as this Russula olivaceoviolascens, doing an only once documented trick : fruiting at 2 metres height from adventitious roots growing towards the inside and into the debris gathered in the open top of the pollarded or "beheaded" trunk of a willow"

 

do it right, or just be living right--either way, That image and account gave me the most beautiful part of what has been a beautiful day. Your patience and persistence that provided the opportunity to preserve such rapturous glory may not have earned automatic credibility, but a stream of heartfelt gratitude flows forth through the e-ether.

 

This far exceeds the gorgeous images of salamanders in redwood 80m up, for the relationship between Russula and Salix is a deep and direct connection. In the past, my first impulse when encountering "rot" in a cavity was to scoop it out and use it as fertilizer. Creating what might be better conditions for compartmentalization and root growth were the goals, but I've learned that drier is not always better for the wood, and roots can by otehr means make their own mojo. (how that translates into dutch i have no ideaaaaaaaa)

 

if there is adventitious root growth and the hope of symbionts as you have illustriously illustrated, I see the folly of intervention, and am content to wonder, and observe. "We still do not know one thousandth of one percent of what nature has revealed to us. Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better."

 

Looking and Listening!

Edited September 2, 2011 by treeseer

[Fungus]

Looking and Listening!

 

Guy,

Nice choice of words, a bit less choice of fungus as a symbol of listening, because this is Hirneola auricula-judae, the last part meaning Judas' ear !

Edited September 2, 2011 by Fungus

[Fungus]

Judas' ear

 

After buttocks and Judas' ear, it's time to show what a nice Dutch style pollarded willow with lots of ferns (Polypodium vulgare) on top looks like.

Apart from the ferns, one can also find plants, such as the bittersweet Solanum dulcamara and Common Honeysuckle, and small trees of elder or rowan, all with berries spread by birds, on top and different saprotrophic macrofungi on the dead wood and debris, together forming a habitat of its own.

---

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

"well... like i said, pollard it (anti shigo method stylie, watch the ISA men cringe!)"

 

No one needs to cringe, except maybe the underinformed and overopinionated. Are there references you can cite for this anti-Shigo/ISA rant?

 

 

 

 

 

 

I thought not. here are some, fyi:

 

Shigo 1986: "Ground pollarding for biomass or fuelwood is commonly done on species of alder or *willow* in Europe". Not much difference between ground pollarding and cutting back to sound wood at any level.

 

ISA's Arborist News 2004: "...What looked like ugly stubs at first grew into attractive, safe and symmetrical portions of our valuable tree canopy. Some observers initially object to the sight of reduced branches because they are reminded of topping cuts. It may be time for the anti-topping passion to cool a little, so we can consider heading cuts without worrying about them looking like topping cuts. ..."

 

ISA's Arborist News 2010: Reduction of tree crowns is largely misunderstood, due in large part to the anti-topping crusade that arborists have had to fight, to prevent that reckless and internodal pruning from ruining more trees. Formal research on crown reduction is extraordinarily difficult due to the immense variables, so one trend has been to repeat simple criteria, like the one-third rules applied to stem walls and branch diameter ratios.

 

Research on structural pruning shows that the removal of one codominant stem will introduce decay into the other, so it should be reduced instead. Reduction slows its growth rate, subordinating the stem into a branch. Discoloration and decay is farther from the fork, protecting the remaining stem. Compartmentalization depends on species, the activity of the parenchyma cells, and the availability of stored material. Late summer crown reduction may elicit the best wound response.

 

"oh and maybe leave the dead fallen limb as habitat."

 

Coarse Woody Debris is heavenly; you should visit my landscape if you want to see deadwood habitat!

 

Ha ha, I shall refrain from entering the fish pond with baited hooks:001_tt2:

 

as for references, I havent the time or the energy to even begin typing all of them even some of them. besides which, unlike SomeI prefer to think for myself and learn from personal experiences, so much more reliable is nature, the very best of all our mentors.

 

I have been looking at pruning, its decays and wild versions of the same for a long long time, I havent a thing to prove, I have 25 years rope and harness work under my belt, and much of my free time inbetween looking at long term adaptation to decay, and the process of a trees long way back down to earth.

 

You have obviously noted my lack of academic flair and style, training even, and on more than one occasion, do I need to remind you that I never have nor ever will claim any credibility?

 

I know your an arb god, more than I ever will be, but then ive got nothing to prove, i just love doing my thing.

[treeseer]

...so much more reliable is nature, the very best of all our mentors.....

 

Well I totally agree with that! As for references, I only quoted Shigo to correct that misimpression. Too often people refer to "Shigo cuts" as if he only saw one right way. his collar cut is so oft-repeated, it has become something of a rigidified myth. He did see the need for flexibility, even from his limited terrestrial perspective.

 

As for citing other references, those were my own looks at pruning, after 45 years and counting in the saddle. See isa-arbor.com, June 2010 et al, no charge, and easily worth the cost! They were all heavily reviewed, and indicate that ISA is also more flexible and comprehensive than it gets credit for. ISA-bashing is a bit of a hot button for me, so I confess to biting too readily at baited hooks.

 

I agree that some ISA materials are too basic and limited, even limiting, but the more people get involved, as Neville Fay did with his excellent piece in the June issue, the better they will get. The studies referred to here at arbtalk sound well worth support from the Tree Fund, if anyone had the stomach for the details and paperwork.

 

With only 25 years' experience, your youthful exuberance is understandable. Kids these days! It's my belief that with pruning, as with ecology, the best nourishment comes from a balanced diet: both academic references, and the Book of Nature. Just one opinion.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Well I totally agree with that! As for references, I only quoted Shigo to correct that misimpression. Too often people refer to "Shigo cuts" as if he only saw one right way. his collar cut is so oft-repeated, it has become something of a rigidified myth. He did see the need for flexibility, even from his limited terrestrial perspective.

 

As for citing other references, those were my own looks at pruning, after 45 years and counting in the saddle. See isa-arbor.com, June 2010 et al, no charge, and easily worth the cost! They were all heavily reviewed, and indicate that ISA is also more flexible and comprehensive than it gets credit for. ISA-bashing is a bit of a hot button for me, so I confess to biting too readily at baited hooks.

 

I agree that some ISA materials are too basic and limited, even limiting, but the more people get involved, as Neville Fay did with his excellent piece in the June issue, the better they will get. The studies referred to here at arbtalk sound well worth support from the Tree Fund, if anyone had the stomach for the details and paperwork.

 

With only 25 years' experience, your youthful exuberance is understandable. Kids these days! It's my belief that with pruning, as with ecology, the best nourishment comes from a balanced diet: both academic references, and the Book of Nature. Just one opinion.

 

Are you trying to tell me that shigo was pro pollarding (internodal) and that the ISA are thinking ecology these days? even veteranising techniques?

 

I am maybe reading too much into this but it would appear from your statement that your a rather big boy in the ISA stakes, a major contributor?

 

I have only read two pieces by you a doctor dendro article and that girdling root article, i would like to read others as I am always willing to listen to something "different" maybe you could show me some of this academic flair you have, and teach me from this 2 decades more experience you have beyond mine.

 

So here i am seated an attending sir, let the lessons begin:thumbup:

[treeseer]

After buttocks and Judas' ear, it's time to show what a nice Dutch style pollarded willow with lots of ferns (Polypodium vulgare) on top looks like.

Apart from the ferns, one can also find plants, such as the bittersweet Solanum dulcamara and Common Honeysuckle, and small trees of elder or rowan, all with berries spread by birds, on top and different saprotrophic macrofungi on the dead wood and debris, together forming a habitat of its own.

---

Judas' ear? I had no idea--that is a bad choice.

 

re buttocks, here is an australian interpretation for the public, and a more general one. I've seen microhabitats in hollows here; will try to get a decent picture of one.

 

hama, your bait is stale and i'm not biting anymore.

Troll over to the Restoration Pruning thread, or follow previous attempt at spoonfeeding: "See isa-arbor.com, June 2010 et al, no charge, and easily worth the cost!"

[treeseer]

Plus, one more dollop; attached are the ANSI A300 pruning standards' how-to guide. ISA and thereby all its members subscribe to these. Judge for yourself how flexible they are--the example in bold is my own but the rest is straight from A300.

 

The idea that pollarding requires internodal cuts does need clarification, starting with the definition of "internodal". What does it mean to you?

ANSI A300 Pruning specs howto 110316.doc

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Judas' ear? I had no idea--that is a bad choice.

 

 

hama, your bait is stale and i'm not biting anymore.

Troll over to the Restoration Pruning thread, or follow previous attempt at spoonfeeding: "See isa-arbor.com, June 2010 et al, no charge, and easily worth the cost!"

 

I wasnt baiting! ha ha christ I was genuinely interested, never mind, im off to the woods to do something origional!

[treeseer]

Still a bit new to this, but have been asked about re-pollarding this (and a few others like it) main stems are a good 12m so its been left for a while - any views or tips?

 

Loggit, here's an example of how a younger one was done in the NE US. After much discussion the arborist went with a more random approach to cut locations than this approach, which tried to optimize structural stability, given proximity to houses and other litigious factors.

 

PRESERVATION PRUNING SPECIFICATIONS

Objective:

Maximize structural stability and health of willow tree. Minimize decay, weak attachments, and heavy ends.

 

Retain aesthetic value of trunk.

 

Specifications:

General: All pruning shall be completed in compliance with A300 and Z133.1 Standards.

Methods: Remove all dead branches over 5 cm/2”.

Reduce declining branches back to the first node that can close the wound, or support stable regrowth. Make no wounds over 10 cm (4”).

Detail: Nodes shall be identified as growth points with lateral branches, visible buds (use hand lens), changes in taper, wrinkled bulges/collars, and other structures indicating bud protection zones.

Reduce or remove rubbing or decayed or cracked or crowded branches to restore symmetry, minimize friction, and maximize collection of sunlight.

 

Retain upright laterals and remove downward laterals.

**Retain as many active buds as possible. Make no cut without a good reason.**

Mulch to the dripline, adding more daylilies if desired. Keep the trunk flare visible.

 

I see your tree has fallen apart, so this may not be that relevant to your case. I have heard you can get away with murder on willows, but it seems that the less that is cut, the less it will sprout, and the less decay and subsequent pruning needs will result. Existing hollows would be undisturbed, and adding mulch or better yet bordering the trunk with unchipped trimmings.