Re-pollard of ancient Willow

[Fungus]

1. all reductions and pollards are a commitment to long term management, are they not ? Willow may not be the species that offer long term stable habitat in any case.

2. If that open split was a known roost then it would be justifiable to manage the tree for that one feature alone, in my opinion. That split is almost certain to be used as a roost at some point, in some way, and is therefore protected by law, is it not ?

 

1. In this case, concerning willows, as you already stated yourself, no. The willows would have (had) a better chance of surviving and being/staying a habitat for animals if they had been pollarded properly to the extent, that their limbs would not have been damaged even more and much closer to the trunk during a storm within the next 5-10 years to such an extent, that the crowns were further destroyed and the trees were lost, unless they were then "pollarded" in the classical Dutch way, which is about two metres above ground level.

2. There's neither evidence of the presence of bats in the split nor in the cavity behind the small hole (black stripes : excrements), but if there was, the trees would be under protection of Dutch flora & fauna law, although they might have to be reduced to avoid risk to the public and without disturbing the habitat.

[treeseer]

"Where dysfunction/wounds/decay exist i ALWAYS leave as much growth developing at the point nearest the wound and as long as possible.

 

Why? because A) it makes resource allocation transport distances far less which in an old tree that may be moving to a sensecent state can be a major player.

 

B) because if growth is allowed to lengthen it will also thicken and result in larger shell walls at the area of worst mechanical stress."

 

Sounds like Botany 102; makes perfect sense to me.

 

That is a more than fair comment, but all reductions and pollards are a commitment to long term management, are they not?

If that open split was a known roost then it would be justifiable to manage the tree for that one feature alone, in my opinion.

Unfortunately, there are precious few trees that offer valuable features and those that do should be cherished. I see what you are saying and perhaps i am playing devils advocate to an extent. Willow may not be the species that offer long term stable habitat in any case. If the feature was a deep cavity in the trunk offering nursery roost potential then there would be no question. That split is almost certain to be used as a roost at some point, in some way, and is therefore protected by law, is it not? If we want to protect the future of sensitive species we are inevitably going to go to stretched lenghts to succeed.

Trees are the center of a tree specific ecosystem.

 

Sounds like Ecology 102. Absolutely. Catastrophic damage may occur, but is highly unlikely if the tree is maintained over time.

[Fungus]

"Where dysfunction/wounds/decay exist i ALWAYS leave as much growth developing at the point nearest the wound and as long as possible. Catastrophic damage may occur, but is highly unlikely if the tree is maintained over time.

 

Catastrophic damage may not, but certainly will occur, because both willows are located in a long stretched "corridor" of open space in between building zones at the top and bottom sides of long canal shaped ponds (see photo's) and have been and will be under heavy wind loads during (summer) rain storms causing major far outreaching limbs, especially at the already damaged and/or wood degraded "hot spots" I showed before, to delaminate and break again, leaving the meanwhile developed ecological niches or habitats and their inhabitants behind on the ground .

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[treeseer]

Catastrophic damage may not, but certainly will occur,...

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Given that reaction wood can form around defects as Tony describes, and assuming that re-pruning can be done per need, I do not see any cause for certainty that catastrophic breakage WILL occur.

 

Also, it's difficult to understand how one height of pollarding can be "proper" in all cases. But there is a lot I do not understand!

[Fungus]

1. Given that reaction wood can form around defects

2. and assuming that re-pruning can be done per need, I do not see any cause for certainty that catastrophic breakage WILL occur.

3. it's difficult to understand how one height of pollarding can be "proper" in all cases.

4. But there is a lot I do not understand!

 

1. How much experience do you have with heavily pruned weeping willows with wide open wounds being able to form enough reaction wood in time to keep ever (and already) present spores of white and brown rotters out of the easily invaded and decomposed dead wood ?

2. Sure re-pruning can be done per need, but not by order of and financed by the local authorities, for which this is a single time effort to preserve the trees.

3. I'm not talking about there's only one height of "proper" pollarding, I said, that in this case the pruining should have been localised behind the delaminated and already decayed "hot spots" in the limbs to prevent the need of short term re-pruining and at the same time preserve the tree (and its ecosystem) on the long run.

4. I couldn't agree more .

[treeseer]

Day Hah! Voodoo.

 

1. How much experience do you have with heavily pruned weeping willows with wide open wounds being able to form enough reaction wood in time to keep ever (and already) present spores of white and brown rotters out of the easily invaded and decomposed dead wood ?

 

Not an overwhelming amount.

 

2. Sure re-pruning can be done per need, but not by order of and financed by the local authorities, for which this is a single time effort to preserve the trees.

 

Short-sighted Cheapskates.

 

3. I'm not talking about there's only one height of "proper" pollarding, I said, that in this case the pruining should have been localised behind the delaminated and already decayed "hot spots" in the limbs to prevent the need of short term re-pruining and at the same time preserve the tree (and its ecosystem) on the long run.

 

But would that work if it is a "single time effort to preserve the tree"?

 

4. I couldn't agree more

 

Will you always be that agreeable?

[Fungus]

"I'm not talking about there's only one height of "proper" pollarding, I said, that in this case the pruining should have been localised behind the delaminated and already decayed "hot spots" in the limbs to prevent the need of short term re-pruining and at the same time preserve the tree (and its ecosystem) on the long run."

But would that work if it is a "single time effort to preserve the tree"?

 

It certainly would give the trees the chance to restore their crowns with much less risk of re-collapsing within the next ten to fifteen years and by that time we'll probably have another city councel that might be willing to finance another effort to long term preserve the trees to avoid a conflict with the recently installed regional Tree Foundation of which I am a consultant.

[treeseer]

It certainly would give the trees the chance to restore their crowns with much less risk of re-collapsing within the next ten to fifteen years and by that time we'll probably have another city councel that might be willing to finance another effort to long term preserve the trees to avoid a conflict with the recently installed regional Tree Foundation of which I am a consultant.

 

Thank you, sir. Context clarifies Objective, which is Step #1 in any pruning plan.

 

Best of fortunes in your political career! Every region should have a tree foundation that is not merely advisory, but has real power.

[Fungus]

... your political career! Every region should have a tree foundation that is not merely advisory, but has real power.

 

No political career for me , as in The Netherlands, tree foundations are independend public and privately funded organisations closely monitoring and evaluating or - if necessary - opposing to anything politicians plan on doing to trees within the town or city councel's boundaries and ultimately taking them to court to force them to abide to laws on trees and/or flora & fauna or ecology management.

[Treecreeper1961]

No political career for me , as in The Netherlands, tree foundations are independend public and privately funded organisations closely monitoring and evaluating or - if necessary - opposing to anything politicians plan on doing to trees within the town or city councel's boundaries and ultimately taking them to court to force them to abide to laws on trees and/or flora & fauna or ecology management.

 

Gerrit,

I have only been a member of this forum for a short time but already it is clear that you are a champion of trees and ecology with authority and demanding respect. Your generosity of passing on your knowledge and learning is great and I hope you will continue to answer my posts in the future even if you find them tedious.

I have recently rediscovered the joy of education and I must admit that the more I learn, the more obvious it becomes that I have an enormous amount to learn.

 

1.Are you suggesting that the trees in your photos should be pollarded at 2m?

 

2. If they are cut at 2m, what will the physiological outcome be, if it can be predicted with assurance?

 

3. How will such drastic removal of biological growth effect the lifespan of these trees?

 

The revised BS3998 strongly recommends keeping cross sectional area of pruning wounds to a minimum. This seems to go against the grain somewhat although it is what I would consider traditional. Just trying to get to grips with current best practice advice versus other more commonly seen practice that can be construed as incorrect.

 

Cheers.