FATHER ZED

I hope I will be forgiven for saying this, but I think it would be worth your while posting this question on the Prospects website's Forum... See: http://tomcat4.prospects.ac.uk:8080/forum/index.php As I understand it, there is subsidy for SOME not ALL F/E courses if you are unemployed - but if you aren't this will be of no use to you... And, even if you are in the position of being able to mysteriously "lose" and then "regain" your job, you'd need to check whether there was any assistance going anyway, first .... (don't quote me on the above ) What have you found out so far, about the course ?? have you found out any info on fees ?? I did a bit of referral work for people, on to courses and the like, in my old job, but the goal posts may have moved significantly since those days ........... and, my remit didn't cover apprenticeships ... so sorry for the limited reply! ;-)

Thanks very much Billy You've given me a lot to think about !!!

Again, some really interesting ideas, and good points! Land wise: I'm hoping to get as much as I can - I aren't going to do any concrete number crunching yet, as it's ALL hypothetical until (i) this gaff has sold, and (ii) I know how much I have to play with and (iii) what I can get X land for, and (iv) whether I can find it in the right place, and without any headaches attached, crappy drainage and suchlike................................ But, I've liked the idea for donkey's years now.... The "pipe dream" is to be able to plant my own coppices, grow my own firewood, sell it, if I have enough... {the village I'm particularly interested in moving to has no gas supply, so was thinking of looking into solid fuel boilers} possibly venture into a bit of roundwood joinery (purely for my own pleasure) ... Also have a quiet liking for horses, so it's a got multiple advantages/lures .. Hi-Ab/truck idea is something I'm very interested in -- especially if I could mill it myself... This throws up and whole new set of questions and things to look at, in addition to the feasibility side of things... ... Hi Ab course --- I'd think you'd need a ticket for insurance, wouldn't you? etc Then, which truck, and how much, fuel costs, .... something with a measure of off road agility .......... Maybe an old MOD Bedford ... or a Mog... Mmmmmmmm {Wonder if you can run any of them on veggie oil, or chip fat Well... I am a Yorkshireman... always say, we make the Scots look positively generous } Well .. thanks Billy, I've gone from having a lot to think about, to a LOT to think about Hope this blooming house sells quickly!

Thanks for the above Anthony ... Some very interesting points, and ideas!!! Funnily enough, I do keep playing with the idea of getting my Sparkie Quals back up to date.... I'm thinking that it might be wiser in this day and age to have my eggs in a few different baskets... So, I might end up doing something similar to your good self! I wouldn't go so far as to say I've ruled out studying Arb altogether, but I'm looking at it in a wider terms now... Cheers :-)

Well.... I think initially, I'm going to focus my attention on selling this house - which has always been the major part of the plan. Goes on the market next week all being well :-) Later on, I think I'll reassess this idea.... Climbing, from a commercial perspective seems to be 99.9% a dead duck.... But, as alluded to above, there's other aspects to the profession.... so perhaps all is not yet lost. Time will tell, I suppose...

A winning, out of date, lottery ticket

Hi Adman, thanks for the above :-) Yes, I think I've slowly come round to this view .... So many people singing from the same hymn sheet - it's bit of a red flag isn't it!!! I'd like to think I might be able to find a niche that would suit me within this industry, outside of climbing... but as I've pointed to in my last post, I think the wisest thing for me to do would be to approach this idea slowly, and see what I'm good at, and what's feasible etc.. When I do finally sell this house, I'm hoping that I'll be able to find some land to buy, as well as a more modest home, so I might venture into firewood ... at least, maybe as an addition to other means of incomes....... I don't really want to give up on the idea completely. But I think I'll have to keep my feet on the ground, and my dreams realistic. I did some climbing at uni, but I'd be the first to admit it was at a quite basic level, and all wall stuff. I'll have forgotten more than i can remember too! Bit of a bummer really! Oh to have known then, what I now know lol

Thank you both for these last couple of replies.... Having slept, and put everyones' contributions in some sort of perspective, I think I asked the wrong question at the start of this thread! I should have asked: "is this feasible?" Everyone has shown a good deal of wisdom in their replies, and it's certainly made me think. I suppose I forget I'm 40 some of the time. As a bit of a 'bolshy git' at heart, I suspect I'm inclined to ignore this fact some of the time too What will I do? I'm not completely sure. The house will go on the market in the next week (I've been doing this pile up to sell), ... and if I'm lucky it will sell quickly - it's a nice gaff, I fancy my chances that someone will fall in love with it like we did. I'll move.... The time frame of all this will have an impact - I might be too late to get on to a course this year anyway - It already been quite near to September ..... I'll lose 6 weeks exchanging contracts... (although I know the short courses are less rigid) On the plus side, I've got some options at least! And more options if I ditch the idea of climbing.... which isn't necessarily the be all and end all ... like you say Taupotreeman, there are other roles I could look at! Possibly putting my eggs in a few different baskets could be the way to go.... I'm not averse to gardening and brush-cutting... for instance, I could do these things to prop me up, while I explore what sort of tree work I can get, or what i can do well ....... There's a few ways I could approach this. Thanks again for your time and patience, everyone! I really do appreciate it !!

Yes, I'd find it hard to argue with you, on any of the points you've raised! I know you're right. Totally. Confused.com lol I'll probably keep bouncing between being excited about the idea (generally, I mean), and also wondering whether I'm as mad as a march hare, and should find an easier path in life! I don't know! Maybe there's some kind of 'happy medium'. The only thing I am sure about now then, is the need to give this more thought! Thanks for your input!

And your dog, if s/he is your dog, looks uncannily like my bitch!

Some REALLY good shots on their!!

Without wishing to sound too braggy, I am quite tenacious. Probably more now, than when I was younger - as the thought of becoming 'of retirement age' puts the fear of God in me! It's not the matter of age that worries me, more the fact that the employment situation is dire, and I REALLY do not want to spend a significant proportion of the next 25/28 years on the unemployed slag-heap. Personality wise, if I think I can find myself a little niche in a field I enjoy, I'll probably damn near kill myself getting from A to B, now to then, if I think I can make it work out ......... That's not to say I won't consider this with some sort of clinical, appraising approach ..... there's other things I could do - go back into the dreaded sparking being one ...... But I do think this is one thing that get's me excited..... You only live once don't you! Also, I agree, I think the PT work, working alongside experienced peeps would be very fruitful!

I can't argue with that Rupe! I'm probably somewhere in the middle territory, fitness wise, at the mo ........ I run to keep fit, periodically, but must admit my motivation varies greatly! To put it in some sort of context, I'm probably fitter than most of the people I went to school with, but I could still be a lot, lot fitter. The evening work wouldn't phase me - my typical Sparking day started at 5 a.m - and I'd get home at 10pm. The most brass I've ever had, even compared to being a desk-jockey, but when I wasn't working I was sleeping It's good food for thought anyway! I'd HAVE to acknowledge the need to get properly fit!

Thanks Rob, Oddly enough, this would be the one bit that least phases me. I've studies at degree level before, and know what's required. And you're right, you do have to be disciplined etc You've made me curious now, I'll have to google Myerscough ....

All VERY true !!!!!!!!!!!! Took me a while to master the art of sparking estimates, so I know where you're coming from on this ................ This is beginning to be slightly bipolar in nature ........ One bit of me thinks it's worth a punt ..... And the other bit thinks I could be courting disaster! More thought required!!!!

Yes, I think you've hit the nail on the head! Self belief, confidence, call it what you will, must be half the battle, at least! For me, the other thing is, at 40, what else is there? I don't want to sound overly pessimistic, but I've been trying to get another job for over a year now - I must have done over a 1000 applications.... I started off looking for stuff at my 'usual' level ... and ended up looking for virtually anything! In West Yorkshire (where I am now), statistically, there is 1 job, per 5 people. Frustration has turned to anger, and anger has turned to lateral thinking. And, part of that lateral thinking is that I might as well try something I'm interested in. If the wheels fall off, I'll have nowt'. But the wheels have already fallen off, and I have nowt now, so how could things be worse ? That's a slight exaggeration, I'm not on bread and water yet, but you'll see my point! Sell up... cheaper house.... see if I can make things a wee bit better. I'm not looking to be making a fortune, just make a living, maybe save a bit. It's a very tempting idea, I must say!

Thanks Rupe, will take all this onboard.

I'm playing with the idea of: Foundation Degree in Arboriculture Course - Moulton College, Northampton -- the Foundation Degree in Arboriculture, and then doing the 1 year top up to turn it into a degree. If I'd only be actually in college a few days a week, that would leave me enough time to earn some brass from gardening, and perhaps do some very basic tree work, to keep the wolf from the door............. I'd value your opinion on this course's suitability ????

Now that's a VERY appealing idea! As I've been mulling this over, I've wondered whether it would be feasible to do it on a self/employed, own business basis ------- with the main bugbear in this idea being that I would need to account for gaps in my own knowledge that someone with years 'in the trade' wouldn't even need to contemplate ................. But, like you suggest here, if i could hire in subbies/freelancers, I might be able to alleviate some of my own shortcomings, and learn from time-served bods into the bargain.... It's a very interesting idea I must say!

Thanks, Rupe, again some very interesting points! I suppose quite predictably, I see quite a bit of cross-over between Sparking and 'trees' --- most tasks in Sparking are really quite simple, and TBH quite a bit of the classroom science isn't used in day-to-day jobbing, unless perhaps you're working in a large site and the distance are big enough to make voltage drop an issue ............... and speed is a big factor. As you factor in man-hours into your quote/tender/estimate, you're not going to be competitive unless you're fairly quick ... and that also comes down to fitness, and 'nacks'... I'm beginning to sense that the variables in the equation I'm looking at, are about how much I can conform to what is necessary then, as much as anything else .......... There's the bits that I can achieve in a relatively straightforward manner - the CS, the quals, getting some tackle .......... And the more spurious...... - the experience, what level of fitness can I reach, earning enough to survive etc ... Mmmmm ... a lot to think about!

Thanks for that Billy, some good points there! I suppose, for the 'experience' side of things, I'll just have to do what I can... do the college stuff to the best of my ability, perhaps practice in my own time (making sure I don't venture into 'tree Base-Jumping by mistake ) Assuming the house sale goes to plan, the investment side of things is probably the easier bit of the two ... at least in a reasonably modest sense.

Hello folks! First thing I'd like to say is, what a great forum this is! Had no idea it existed until I stumbled on it by chance the other day! Anyway, to cut to the chase .... Having been made redundant last year, I've been re-evaluating a few things, and am frankly sick to death of banging my head against the 'job applications' wall ......... My interest in forestry, and 'trees' generally, goes back to my late teens. I had a couple of mates that worked in the forests of a nearby estate - their Pop was the estate manager. When the opportunities arose, I'd go and give them a hand, and did have the chance to help the elder of the 2 brothers with a commercial fell for a couple of days .......... I think it's a mixture of the proximity to nature, the industry's necessity for Big Boys' Toys , and the fact that you're out and about, rather than suffering death-by-battery-hen syndrome Whilst I should perhaps have seen The Light years ago, I now find myself at a point in life where I need to find a radical change of direction... and, like everyone else on the planet, I'd rather do something I enjoy! I'm hoping to move later in the year, which will hopefully free some cash up too. The area I'm thinking of moving to is quite near to a college that does the required quals, at various levels, so, in theory, everything should/could fall into place quite neatly ................. My first question for the Forum then is: If I pursue this, get the quals, and invest in X, Y and Z, do you think there is enough work/jobs to go around ???????? I'm mainly (but not exclusively) interested in working for myself - I've been self-employed before (electrician), and know that the first year or so can be hard, until you've established yourself, but aside from that, how do you think the industry as a whole is fairing in this pretty awful economic climate ???? Thanks for any input offered!