Jesse

Ban me you half wits ****

**** double ****

****, ****, ****

i can't believe in the context of my post the mods have censored an old saying from when difficult times have come to a head. 'The **** has hit the fan' but its ok to show the dead limp body of a boy on tv, but not my comments, poor show you mods.

Not strictly true - I remember seeing distressing images before we ever had the internet. Mostly via library books & photo library images, and I've also seen a number of shocking photos taken by friends in the forces.

 

The internet is just a faster and wider method of communicating.

 

It's not just one little boy. Sadly.

cheers, steve

Agree, i was not argumenting a case, just very few or less folk seem to bother with reading documents events in this day and age. Not even condoning current media preferences, just stating it's not the first or the last , amazing how quickly those images have evoked a positive reaction. You could even say in oldboy terms ' The **** has hit the fan'

Now my view on this, yes shocking, atrocities have been going on all around the world for years, a lifetime and more, 30 year war and all. Facebook... modern media, had it not been for the mobile phone and modern technology we would all be none the wiser. As a ex serving marine i have seen shocking images from around the world first hand, none were ever broadcast as at that point in time technology was not available, no one will ever see them. Shame it's taken the exploitation of this little boy's life to shame a reaction .

Have a shown you my fine feathered cockerel.... must have done, but here he is again, he's getting really friendly now and much prefers to stoop inside and watch TV than go outside, could be as he's getting old.

Hi Adam, i know what you're going through , same decision i did come to, mine came about the pains had got so bad on the day of my decision i went to A & E things were that bad, first thing in the morning, lady on the counter asked me what's wrong, i said where do i start, i was at that point in my life actually pissing / passing blood from bruffin abuse. to cut a long storey very short, its amazing what taking a year off from whats a very abusive physical job can do, i now work one or two days a week, charge max on that work as a subby but mostly grind stumps and it keeps the wolf away. i could consult but the time to pound ratio dictates time best spent grinding first, subby second, consultation work really does my head in . 53 now and after a year off things are ok, still climbing . AGAIN

Cat amongst the pigeons now, food for thinking,

Stump grinding £100 to £150 per hour

Consultancy work, ( in my area ) £60 per hour

Subby climber with chipper £32 per hour

Keeps me happy

So coming up to 19 years industry working and I've had enough. I have arthritis in both my wrists and in my right elbow. Some days I wake up crying and others are just a struggle.

I'm not entirely sure when I will leave the game or if I'll stay in the industry at all. I'm holding out for something I'm not even sure is there but what will be will be.

So yeah discussion open as usual guys, I've met some fantastic people along the way, and a handful to whom I owe a huge amount to.

Really don't know what else to say to be honest, kind of upset that I'm actually writing this but it's been bothering me for a while now and I just needed to reach out to someone who understands I guess!

 

Thanks everyone

 

Adam

Hi Adam, i know what you're going through , same decision i did come to, mine came about the pains had got so bad on the day of my decision i went to A & E things were that bad, first thing in the morning, lady on the counter asked me what's wrong, i said where do i start, i was at that point in my life actually pissing / passing blood from bruffin abuse. to cut a long storey very short, its amazing what taking a year off from whats a very abusive physical job can do, i now work one or two days a week, charge max on that work as a subby but mostly grind stumps and it keeps the wolf away. i could consult but the time to pound ratio dictates time best spent grinding first, subby second, consultation work really does my head in . 53 now and after a year off things are ok, still climbing . AGAIN

I'm all for education, every day is a school day here on Arbtalk. I can't say that my postings are any more right than other folks', most of the time, but there is a lot of rubbish talked and things cited as facts by people on Arbtalk but they are factually incorrect or don't reflect the true state of the law. Some of them are backed up by stubborn attitides, and at that point objectivity of perspective disappears and it just becomes vindictive. I think that all you can say about what's on Arbtalk is generally well-intended and based in some understanding of the law but it isn't entirely reliable and for sure isn't a substitute for structured learning through an authoritative source. Personally I can't easily stand by and see erroneous information passed off as correct.

 

I think where the great strength of arbtalk lies is in gving a collective overview of the pragmatic approach that can be taken day-to-day in tree work. That doesn't mean it's 'right', but commercially we all have to cut corners or make compromises and more generally have to get on with things without stopping to take legal advice every time a twig might fall into a neighbour's garden. I expect the reason why there are not court precedents covering trivial encroachments and trespasses is that the courts do not concern themselves with them (de minimus non curat juris) and quite right too. Ordinary behaviour will always rely on ordinary ethics and attitudes towards other people, and the law only gets involved when the consequences of unreasonable behaviour are significant.

 

So reliance on what is presented as acceptable on Arbtalk could lead someone into a situation where they are legally and technically in the wrong but the consequences have got to a scale that results in them being on the wrong end of a court decision. Not too late to un-learn the wrong version of the law, but it won't be a defence to say that someone on Arbtalk said it was OK however nice his watch and shoes were.

 

I have no comment on your LA saga, I do work for LA's and I see both sides of the story. It probably merits a separate posting.

Your spot on with everything you said, i was off on one yesterday after hearing what my LA had been trying to worm out of, my LA have very big problems with double standards and procedure following, I won't do a separate post , best just to let them carry on digging a very big hole.

It doesn't mattrer how many times thios issue comes up on Arbtalk, there are always new interpretations of the law and the question never gets answered. The origonal poist wasn't even a question, just an unattributed 'quote'.

 

Meantime Dowsons Law seems fine insofar as deciding if the land owner who receives involuntarily fruit or prunings is a theif or not. But it says nothing about whether a tree owner, who might enter his airspace to prune an overhanging branch can chuck it down onto the poor man's lawn then go around and collect it, is in the wrong. Or whether he should cut it in small enough pieces that he can drag it back through the tree onto his own land.

 

You can talk about common law and Mynors and adrmiralty law and whatever Lemmon precedents you want to, but in the end a court if asked to will look at what is reasonable. Or more immediately if someone chucked their prunings onto my garden instead of recovering them through the tree, and then wandered around nochalantly to collect them from my garden, I know who the bobbies would side with in the ensuing ugly altercation.

 

Lazy! Inconsiderate. Rude! Unnecessary. Intrusive. Getting close to what the law would call 'unreasonable'?

Besides the point you're hinting at, are we at fault for trying to educate ourselves, those members, who have invested in arboricultural education, privately, and one step further than most members on here, no digs intended. are only doing so to improve themselves . Whats wrong with that, now let me ask another question, this one directed at local authorities, who are funded for everything, get paid to go to work, get paid holidays, pensions, you name it. I looked at a stump today, the tree had failed and fallen on a car, lots of damage, road side tree LA owned tree, in the center of Taunton. Luckily no one injured. The party involved came outside to ask why i was looking at the stump, i said it was to grind, i also said should be fairly easy as it was 2 3rds decayed with Ganoderma adspersum wide spread at the base. My point being.... the LA had denied any fault with the tree, and refused any compensation stating that the tree was healthy and had records of inspections, :lol: two road side trees further along are standing half dead, and on the other side of the road is another tree succumb with Armillaria, my point being we are paying the LA to maintain these trees, and at the same time we are all being rimmed by our own LAs . Never take any advice or statements from a local authority as being true.

Just trying to put my point across about how education can help. This will be ongoing, photos taken by the third party once i explained why the failure occurred.

Recently got a new Stihl MS 201 TC-M only seems to use just over a quarter of a tank of oil a each fill. Anyone have the same thing going on or is this a problem? Oil adjustment is turned up.

Yep, mine is the same, keep meaning to give Justin a call.

:biggrin:When I see him at the AA conference next month I know I'm going to end up peering at his watch and shoes, cheers Jesse

The words Bling and Rolex come to mind, fair play to him,

Runs Treelife AC.

 

An old 'name' in the industry (meant with respect) who worked behind the scenes on a lot of the Brit Standards, the guidance on bats and the arborist, things like that. Also known as 'God' when submitting assignments for moderation:biggrin:

 

A really interesting fellow to be taught by, whose own interests in arboriculture just enthuses everyone the class. Lots of 'in' jokes appear on here from ex or not-yet-ex students because the learning experience he creates. It's difficult to explain, but he's a great teacher that encourages and inspires.

I'll second that. He always had a nice watch and shoes .

Bonjour!

 

"The owner of a tree is free to come upon your land to prune or to recover prunings without committing trespass, even if you refuse him permission to do so."

 

Talk to me.

 

Kind Regards

 

PhaUst

I'll try again with this one, even to put it another way, in arb simple terms,

If you enter someone's garden without asking to retrieve what ever arisings you have dropped over you run the risk of

1 Legal action if you damage something or if what was dropped into the garden damaged something, and this could even just be the lawn,

2 Civil action , this could just develop from an anul retentive land owner , for almost any reason that they could find, as to why you have entered their garden without permission and be very expensive to for you to defend.

3 Most common, a straight punch to the head, then questions asked, as they may believe you to be a burglar, police would do very little.

Best to ask first and if no one is in leave a note with your details and call again in the evening. why run the risk of upsetting anyone and tarnishing your reputation, better still don't drop anything next door, or even better introduce yourself to them at the start of the job, you may even pick up more work once they have met you.

Bonjour!

 

"The owner of a tree is free to come upon your land to prune or to recover prunings without committing trespass, even if you refuse him permission to do so."

 

Talk to me.

 

Kind Regards

 

PhaUst

Permission is required by law otherwise its trespassing, but its a little different with trees and owners of, as you can not refuse access if the only way of abating the nuisance is via access over your land, they still need to ask, and you can stipulate conditions such as timings, and what machinery they bring onto your land. Look up, i think its called "Access to neighbouring land act" i would need to look it up again but anyone who has recently done Tech cert will know. The act of theft of branch and cordwood, or fruit is defined as Conversion and to gain access to someones land without permission is Trespass.

Ha,Ha. Ok I only use Subby climbers, if they were to put on a chipper and truck then it's gotta be £300 if they get no work then don't go down that route. I don't see how people can sub us or not can charge less and make money

So lad, are we now excepting the mark of £250 + vat

Agreed, find your own work at at least double your income, that kind of money you should be able to get with a hedge cutter and a bicycle!

I won't divulge how i make the most money from my little chipper venture other than to say its by the hour, and that first hour is a golden one, , cannot give too many secrets away in life or everyone would have a new tw230 and that's not poking fun at anyone, i'm not new to this game, done it a long time, and not just in this country, and not only used my arms and back, made good of going to school and university, it's a very competitive market and you do need to think how you can maximize your time and any investment. my mission statement now is ' Work as little as possible for as much as possible ' running a company and employing staff consumed my life beyond belief , it all became a chase for the work to feed the company. much better work balance now.

I charge myself out at £150 a day. Have since I started. Surely a tipper and chipper is worth at least £150 a day?

The main contractor will then put whatever he or she wants on top of that. Up to them.

 

Whether it be one of their full time groundies or another freelance groundie. They'll still make money on top of that without having the running costs of sending out a second team.

Forget making any money on your tipper, most run transits or trailers, i only provide mine as it allows me down time to unload at home and have a cup of tea before going back to do the next load, as i said, i need the timber and can use the wood chip, so it then boils down to chipper, and you can't charge much for something that's unreliable, but you have to be comparable to local hire companies, if you have the latest kit you're one step above the hire companies . What you would like and what you will get are two very different margins. work smart. i charge £1 per mile travel money, every bit helps

Bloody hell that's cheap!!!

 

The main point for me is that all those things listed above are really only covering their costs whereas I want them to be making money to grow the business.

You can analyze costs as much as you like, a simple costing can also be based on this,

A contractor can go out and hire a chipper newish one for what, ... £70 or £90 a day ?

I was charging myself and still do if they don't need a chipper for £180

£180 + £70 = £250 all plus vat

I also get to keep all the wood. My main money is made from stump grinding which works out to be very good money, only problem with stump grinding the woods already left site, and i do get through the timber.

So after you reading all these posts what were you going to charge ???

I don't know that, that is right Ian!

 

I sub because I can't be bothered with all the shite that goes with running a "proper" business, it suits me to pick and choose what I do.

 

I'm never short of work, infact I turn work away most months.

Thats how i think, been there done it.

Is that climbing or groundwork?

Thats climbing or ground work, same rate. good thing is, if its climbing, the chipper only runs when i am back on the ground, and the contractor knows if its ground work i can keep up with anything they clearing. Its normally me who does any skillful cutting, i also seem to run the jobs which i am subbed in for. Works really well, i find i clear more profit then when i actually ran a dedicated tree surgery company, and paid out wages.

Just wondering if there was a market for an experienced climber, truck and chipper in the glos, worcs and warwks areas.

Also, what would people expect to pay for the above?

Looking at getting my own work but subbing out whilst getting started. Have regular work just doing the contract climbing but is a van and chipper more of a draw?

Truck not sign written.

Cheers

Dan

I do exactly that now, but also check sites out with the LPA first , to cover me mainly , but also the contractors i sub for like it as an add on, just got the new tw230, don't work every day subbing, as i also do a lot of other things, but i do get £250 a day for my troubles + vat and remove the arisings . My truck is sign written but my contractors know im not interested in quoting anymore. Main summer interest is fishing, anyone can be a busy fool but not me.

Hi Jesse no sounds good I Bring you some cider from sunny Somerset So you can have after fishing 👍👍thanks Jon

Now that sounds good, dont forget Tom, i know he got a real thing about apple juice ,

Hi JESSE sound great how large is your boat mate thanks Jon

Big enough for you , me and tom, i only got 3 rods, eny more its a squeeze plus i will need to pull up and replenish a few pots, or are you now thinking of the wiofe, sort of after thinking, they normally think it sounds nice, sort of like a mini med cruise, but its not like that on my boat, fast, furious, and when we hit the fish they just keep cumming . The fish that is,