Where to start! climbing kits

[Andy Clark]

Simple answer = Self Employed to him for 3 years now

 

Makes no difference mate..... none at all!!!

 

The legal precedence relates to the premise of continual employment, not how your wages/tax are payed.

 

If you work solely for him, then you are classed as an employee, and the same rules apply.......

 

If you're a "subby climber" and work for numerous different companies, then and ONLY then is it down to you.

[Frankie Lawrence]

Makes no difference mate..... none at all!!!

 

The legal precedence relates to the premise of continual employment, not how your wages/tax are payed.

 

If you work solely for him, then you are classed as an employee, and the same rules apply.......

 

If you're a "subby climber" and work for numerous different companies, then and ONLY then is it down to you.

 

Are you sure? Maybe I'm wrong but I thought subbies have to provide there own stuff and the firm they mainly work for has no legal obligation to pay anything.

I thought in effect being a subby is having your own bussiness therefore why should another bussiness help you out they have no oblegation to.

[Andy Clark]

O.k, got a few differnces of opinion to my views.... which is fair enough.....

 

 

 

But look at it this way...... yeah, the boss might get the hump and give the him the boot..... but would you REALLY want to work for someone that put your safety on the line at such a whim???

 

 

I know damn well that i wouldn't!!

[Frankie Lawrence]

O.k, got a few differnces of opinion to my views.... which is fair enough.....

 

 

 

But look at it this way...... yeah, the boss might get the hump and give the him the boot..... but would you REALLY want to work for someone that put your safety on the line at such a whim???

 

 

I know damn well that i wouldn't!!

 

But he isnt realy is he? He said that is the reason for by his own, if the boss made him go up there then its a different matter.

[Andy Clark]

But he isnt realy is he? He said that is the reason for by his own, if the boss made him go up there then its a different matter.

 

Course he is!! The boss should be providing safe and legaly compliant kit kit, and not putting him in the position that he has to buy his own!

 

At the end of the day, it's shortcuts like this, that are the reason he can afford a DB9.

[Frankie Lawrence]

!

 

At the end of the day, it's shortcuts like this, that are the reason he can afford a DB9.

 

Best thing you've said all thread:001_tt2:lol.

 

I do think you have got a valid point about the DB9 I think as someone said above see if you cant do some deal you dont pay him back for the corse and you buy your kit its not ideal but I do think you dont have any rights as a 'subbie'

[Andy Clark]

Best thing you've said all thread:001_tt2:lol.

 

I do think you have got a valid point about the DB9 I think as someone said above see if you cant do some deal you dont pay him back for the corse and you buy your kit its not ideal but I do think you dont have any rights as a 'subbie'

 

Why your employment status is important

Each type of employment status has different legal rights, so it is important to know which category you fall into. Your employment status will determine your rights at work.

 

Employment status is different from your working pattern. So as well as an 'employee' or 'worker' your working arrangement might be described in one or more of the following terms.

 

part-time

fixed-term

contractor

consultant

casual

zero hours

seasonal

agency or 'temp'

office holder

volunteer

 

Various factors will determine your employment status. For example, just because you have a contract that describes you as an 'employee' or as 'self-employed' does not mean that it is the case.

 

If you are unsure about your employment status, read the other articles in this section. They outline some of the points that help determine employment status and include example situations to help you decide if they apply to you.

 

Agency workers Casual or irregular work Employees

Office holders

Independent contractors or consultants

Personal service consultants

Seasonal or fixed-term contracts

Volunteers

 

Employment Tribunal decisions on your employment status

Ultimately only a court or Employment Tribunal can make a final decision on your employment status. They will base their decision on a number of different factors, which are in line with legal tests developed through case law.

 

An Employment Tribunal will look at how an employment relationship works in practice to determine your employment status. They will look at whether:

 

you have to take on the work personally, rather than sending a substitute or sub-contracting the work

your work provider has a significant degree of control, or right of control, over you

you are paid a regular salary

your employer or work provider deducts tax and National Insurance (rather than you being responsible for making these payments)

you receive holiday pay, sick pay, maternity pay etc

you work at your employer's premises and use your employer's tools and/or facilities

you are integrated into the business (for example, if you appear in the company organisational chart, are subject to the company's disciplinary and grievance procedures)

you have any financial risk or reward, for example bonuses depending on how quickly or well the work is performed

you work exclusively for one business rather than performing work for a number of 'customers'

you have an employment contract or any other contractual documentation, eg a letter of appointment, which describes you as an employee (also know as a statement of mutual intention)

 

Normally if you are self-employed for tax purposes, you will be self-employed in relation to your employment rights. However, if you are self-employed for tax purposes it will not prevent an Employment Tribunal from finding that you are an 'employee' or a 'worker' for employment law purposes. HMRC's decisions are not binding on Employment Tribunals.

[Frankie Lawrence]

I do understand most of that.

 

Do You mind if I ask if you are an employee or a subbie? And if you are a subbie with your own bussiness as in have blokes in on a regular basis?

 

Maybe if you put your self in the shoes of his empoyer you may ee it differently?

 

Once again just to remind you that I do an employer should buy there employes kit im merely just trying to look at it from an emploerrs point of view.

[Andy Clark]

16 years on the tools as both a subby and direct empolyee climber..... for 2/3 man bands, right up to big international sized companies........ then on to college lecturing, then on to contract management, employing some of the biggest contracting companies in the UK industry... so as far as experience goes, i've had to cover and deal with both sides of the coin.

 

But taking it a step further as a contract manager that has employed companies, i know the tricks and loop-holes that companies TRY and exploit...... even had to repremand an AAAC once upon a time, for pulling a similar trick with regards to staff training.

[Frankie Lawrence]

16 years on the tools as both a subby and direct empolyee climber..... for 2/3 man bands, right up to big international sized companies........ then on to college lecturing, then on to contract management, employing some of the biggest contracting companies in the UK industry... so as far as experience goes, i've had to cover and deal with both sides of the coin.

 

But taking it a step further as a contract manager that has employed companies, i know the tricks and loop-holes that companies TRY and exploit...... even had to repremand an AAAC once upon a time, for pulling a similar trick with regards to staff training.

 

Blimey maybe I should stop now

 

So if my cotract doesnt state PPE does that mean its off his back?