What heating system and why

[Woodworks]

If this is your last house start with sorting the insulation. Long term this will save you more and be more environmentally friendly. Have a look at external wall insulation (EWI) and if thats not an option internal wall insulation (IWI).  Fitted EWI on my dads old farmhouse and its been transformed with no internal impact. We converted a barn with IWI  and a ground source heat pump and its brilliant but we were starting from scratch not disrupting a functioning home. Once insulated you wont need much of a heating system.

 

No point in changing your current night storage with new ones if they still work ok. To all intensive purposes direct electric is 100% efficient the only variable is how long it can store the heat for.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Woodworks

[sandspider]

Is EWI ugly? I guess there's a choice of finishes...? And the better the finish the more expensive?

[Woodworks]

37 minutes ago, sandspider said:

Is EWI ugly? I guess there's a choice of finishes...? And the better the finish the more expensive?

Loads of choices of finish. Found some pics of the surface coat going on dads place. Half the house is done as in the picture and the other half we slate hung with insulation behind. The later is more expensive on materials but can be done by a competent DIYer saving a few bob.

[sandspider]

Thanks. Something we might want to do in future as our house is old and cold and stoney. Pretty though!

[neiln]

Ok someone save me reading pages 2 to 5, does it get less depressing than it starts?  The answer is a wood gasification boiler, a wood pellet boiler or 2 wood stoves, ordered by cost and effectiveness.

 

Thread closed.  ?

 

Really though, a decent sized wood burner, or a couple will take care of most of the heating needs. Then air source heat pump and oversized rads works fine (or at least it does for my brother).  Use the heat pump in the mornings when the stoves have gone cold, or all day when being lazy.

 

For My 'forever home' I'd look at wood gasification boiler though.  Right now I may enjoy scrounging, cutting, splitting and stacking...(actually no the stacking is a ball ache) 3+ cords is wood a year so much that my mains gas c/h runs about once a fortnight only, but as I get older I can imagine hankering strongly for the comfort and convenience of c/h.  A large gasification boiler would be an attractive option if I could scrounge wood still.

[Nopedigree]

The following gives a overview of various energy costs whic I find interesting copied from

 

Energy Cost Comparison – Nottingham Energy Partnership

NOTTENERGY.COM

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Visit the post for more.

Energy Cost Comparison – July 2020

Fuel	Fuel price (p per unit)	Unit	Pence per kWh (after boiler efficiency)	Energy content (kWh per unit)	CO2e emissions per kWh*
Electricity Standard Rate1	20.58	kWh	20.58 (100%)	1	0.288
Electricity Online Rate1	20.78	kWh	20.78 (100%)	1	0.288
Mains Gas Standard Rate2	3.99	kWh	4.75 (90%)	1	0.208
Mains Gas Online Rate2	4.28	kWh	4.75 (90%)	1	0.208
Kerosene3	30.07	Litre	3.41 (90%)	9.8	0.298
Gas oil4	47.95	Litre	5.12 (90%)	10.4	0.316
LPG5	42.59	Litre	6.66 (90%)	6.66	0.241
Butane6	167.99	Litre	23.42 (90%)	7.97	0.241
Propane7	74.24	Litre	11.67 (90%)	7.07	0.241
Seasoned Wood8	22.39	Kg	6.27 (85%)	4.20	0.028
Pellets9	26.33	Kg	6.20 (90%)	4.72	0.053
Smokeless fuel10	42.78	Kg	8.58 (75%)	8.51	0.396
Coal10	31.85	Kg	6.18 (75%)	6.20	0.396
GSHP11	20.58	kWh	5.88 (350%)	1	0.082
ASHP11	20.78	kWh	7.70 (270%)	1	0.107

*C02e emissions are based on UK Government GHG Conversion Factors for Company Reporting Scope 3, which includes emissions from Transmission and Distribution

References:

1. Electricity: Based on an average of the 6 major electricity suppliers’ online prepayment, credit and direct debit tariffs, including standing charges and VAT, but not Economy 7.  Data used are the Tariff Comparison Rates (TCR) provided on the 6 major energy suppliers’ website.
2. Gas: Based on an average of the 6 major gas suppliers’ standard prepayment, credit and direct debit tariffs, including standing charges and VAT.  Data used are the Tariff Comparison Rates (TCR) provided on the 6 major energy suppliers’ website.
3. Kerosene: Based on an average prices from Boiler Juice, Heating Oiland Home Fuels Direct.
4. Gas Oil: Based on an average prices from Boiler Juice, HeatingOil and Home Fuels Direct.
5. LPG: Based on an average prices from Calor Gas (0800 626 626),  Extra Fueland Nottinghamshire LPG.
6. Butane: Based on prices from Flogas.
7. Propane: Based on an average prices from: Flogas, and Calor Gas – 0800 662 663. Note: The bottled gas market is very competitive and prices vary. It is recommended that you contact as many suppliers as possible in your area for the best price. We have used the CO2eq factor of LPG, as both propane and butane are components of LPG and there is currently no specific GHG conversion factor for these
8. Seasoned Wood: Based on an average prices from House Fuel, Logs Coal UK, and Nottinghamshire Logs.  We have used the CO2factor as there is currently no specific GHG CO2eq conversion factor for this. Note: The values for seasoned logs have been updated based on the latest information on the Net CVs of Seasoned logs from Biomass Energy Centre. 
9. Wood Pellets: Based on average prices from Wood Pellets Stove, Forever Fuels and Logs2U. 
10. Smokeless fuel and coal: Based on average prices from Coal Delivery, Coals2U and Coal Merchant. We have used the CO2eq factor of coal, as the components of smokeless fuels are coal-based and there is currently no specific GHG conversion factor for this.
11. GSHP (Ground Source Heat Pump) and ASHP (Air Source Heat Pump): Based on best electricity price taken from electric online rate. The boiler efficiency used in the calculation is based on the best available information from Review of Technical Information on Renewable Heat Technologies Report 2011.

Regards,

 

NoPedigree

Edited August 20, 2020 by Nopedigree
To add web address

[Nopedigree]

Must admit to feeling a little smug having managed to secure upto two years heating oil ( depending how cold the winter will be) at .20ppl together with 4 plus years stacked wood for the two stoves, free bar time, effort and fuel for the saw. By more luck than judgement I susspect I will never be in the same position for the same expenditure ever again.

All I need now is for the 26 year old Rayburn to keep plodding on, touching a large pice of oak while crossing fingers!

NoPedigree

 

 

[donnk]

On 20/08/2020 at 11:21, Nopedigree said:

The following gives a overview of various energy costs whic I find interesting copied from

 

Energy Cost Comparison – Nottingham Energy Partnership

NOTTENERGY.COM

---

Visit the post for more.

Energy Cost Comparison – July 2020

Fuel	Fuel price (p per unit)	Unit	Pence per kWh (after boiler efficiency)	Energy content (kWh per unit)	CO2e emissions per kWh*
Electricity Standard Rate1	20.58	kWh	20.58 (100%)	1	0.288
Electricity Online Rate1	20.78	kWh	20.78 (100%)	1	0.288
Mains Gas Standard Rate2	3.99	kWh	4.75 (90%)	1	0.208
Mains Gas Online Rate2	4.28	kWh	4.75 (90%)	1	0.208
Kerosene3	30.07	Litre	3.41 (90%)	9.8	0.298
Gas oil4	47.95	Litre	5.12 (90%)	10.4	0.316
LPG5	42.59	Litre	6.66 (90%)	6.66	0.241
Butane6	167.99	Litre	23.42 (90%)	7.97	0.241
Propane7	74.24	Litre	11.67 (90%)	7.07	0.241
Seasoned Wood8	22.39	Kg	6.27 (85%)	4.20	0.028
Pellets9	26.33	Kg	6.20 (90%)	4.72	0.053
Smokeless fuel10	42.78	Kg	8.58 (75%)	8.51	0.396
Coal10	31.85	Kg	6.18 (75%)	6.20	0.396
GSHP11	20.58	kWh	5.88 (350%)	1	0.082
ASHP11	20.78	kWh	7.70 (270%)	1	0.107

*C02e emissions are based on UK Government GHG Conversion Factors for Company Reporting Scope 3, which includes emissions from Transmission and Distribution

References:

1. Electricity: Based on an average of the 6 major electricity suppliers’ online prepayment, credit and direct debit tariffs, including standing charges and VAT, but not Economy 7.  Data used are the Tariff Comparison Rates (TCR) provided on the 6 major energy suppliers’ website.
2. Gas: Based on an average of the 6 major gas suppliers’ standard prepayment, credit and direct debit tariffs, including standing charges and VAT.  Data used are the Tariff Comparison Rates (TCR) provided on the 6 major energy suppliers’ website.
3. Kerosene: Based on an average prices from Boiler Juice, Heating Oiland Home Fuels Direct.
4. Gas Oil: Based on an average prices from Boiler Juice, HeatingOil and Home Fuels Direct.
5. LPG: Based on an average prices from Calor Gas (0800 626 626),  Extra Fueland Nottinghamshire LPG.
6. Butane: Based on prices from Flogas.
7. Propane: Based on an average prices from: Flogas, and Calor Gas – 0800 662 663. Note: The bottled gas market is very competitive and prices vary. It is recommended that you contact as many suppliers as possible in your area for the best price. We have used the CO2eq factor of LPG, as both propane and butane are components of LPG and there is currently no specific GHG conversion factor for these
8. Seasoned Wood: Based on an average prices from House Fuel, Logs Coal UK, and Nottinghamshire Logs.  We have used the CO2factor as there is currently no specific GHG CO2eq conversion factor for this. Note: The values for seasoned logs have been updated based on the latest information on the Net CVs of Seasoned logs from Biomass Energy Centre. 
9. Wood Pellets: Based on average prices from Wood Pellets Stove, Forever Fuels and Logs2U. 
10. Smokeless fuel and coal: Based on average prices from Coal Delivery, Coals2U and Coal Merchant. We have used the CO2eq factor of coal, as the components of smokeless fuels are coal-based and there is currently no specific GHG conversion factor for this.
11. GSHP (Ground Source Heat Pump) and ASHP (Air Source Heat Pump): Based on best electricity price taken from electric online rate. The boiler efficiency used in the calculation is based on the best available information from Review of Technical Information on Renewable Heat Technologies Report 2011.

Regards,

 

NoPedigree

not really accurate as it doesnt refelct time of day useage which is the only relevant measure.

 

4-5p kw/h is what should be paying to drive the heatpump. Powerwall/battery to time shift useage will become the norm electric cars can do this for you, the house draws from them when power is expensive - 4pm-8pm - and they fill back up when its free/cheap.

 

Burning anything at all will be going to the way of diesel/petrol cars as its just bad for the planet.

 

 

 

 

[mhrfm]

We’ve gone down the air source heat pump route.

 

You might find this interesting, because we share how and why we chose an air source heat pump to heat our home, and discuss some our experiences with installers.

 

 

 

You can the check out our installation experience fitting an air source heat pump and new water tank in our Victorian farmhouse.

 

 

 

Air source heat pumps are really worth looking into.

[Nopedigree]

On 20/08/2020 at 11:41, Nopedigree said:

Must admit to feeling a little smug having managed to secure upto two years heating oil ( depending how cold the winter will be) at .20ppl together with 4 plus years stacked wood for the two stoves, free bar time, effort and fuel for the saw. By more luck than judgement I susspect I will never be in the same position for the same expenditure ever again.

All I need now is for the 26 year old Rayburn to keep plodding on, touching a large pice of oak while crossing fingers!

NoPedigree

 

 

Just reading on the local next door  site that someone's having to pay 1.29 pl for heating oil with a three week wait for delivery.. bl@@dy hell!

still got over half a tank left from 2020 @ .20p pl, so hopefully things will better price wise 2023/24.

 

NoPedigree