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Surrey Wildlife Trust to fell thousands of Ash trees

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1 hour ago, steve collins said:

Yes your right it was the objector who was saying fell at 2m but from what i can gather is that he is also the owner of two of the woodlands so id hope he gets a say in whatever process they choose.

 

They should just identify the worst trees and come in with a thinning programme which may take out pockets of trees but leave the remaining trees for monitoring/inspection and less chance of windblow, also the retained trees can be identified easy for ongoing works.

 

Harvesters are an option where they can cut the easier material(cleaner/straighter) but the head/machine does take a hammering, personally its a hand cut and winch job.

 

Im sure the job has gone out to tender, be interesting to see who won it and how its being completed

 

 

Ur mibee right about the objector owning the woods althou i just assumed hr owned other woods in that area.

It would depned on the contrct/lease/agteement but i wouldn't be happy if i owned woodland and the management company (wether wildlife trust or not) were going against my wishes.

 

But to be fair i woudn't be expecting to put anyone in danger like that cutting the trees at 2m.

Just because he owns woodland doesn't mean he knows wot he's talking about.

 

To me it just reads like a typical paper non story

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Being pragmatic, Ash as a species is done. Everything else is nonsense, 95-98% will go in the next few years. 

 

Misguided attempts to save an odd tree or to create pollards that aren't going to survive and will be more risky to deal with in the future are pointless. If they've got to go, the best option will always be the safest and most cost affective (but it's always easier spending someone else's money. 

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Gary Prentice said:

Being pragmatic, Ash as a species is done. Everything else is nonsense, 95-98% will go in the next few years. 

I'm not sure of the science of the time-scale a natural resistance will build up but yes I think you are right  vast majority of the current population will be  susceptible

15 minutes ago, Gary Prentice said:

 

Misguided attempts to save an odd tree or to create pollards that aren't going to survive and will be more risky to deal with in the future are pointless. If they've got to go, the best option will always be the safest and most cost affective (but it's always easier spending someone else's money.

 Again from, experience with beech after the 1987 windblow, I agree, If the crown of a mature tree shows signs of dieback it has no resistance to all intents and purposes, so a prudent woodland owner will probably take the decision to harvest before there is sufficient secondary infection to lessen the value.

 

Although I did comment on what may be driving SWT's decision  I'm not against it and see no reason not to fell at ground level and maximise return on timber. I just hope they have a fair agreement such that the harvesting costs allow a decent return on sales, even if internal. I am sanguine about  their firewood operation and in fact advocated it 30 years ago. What I am not so sure about is their competence to run it efficiently.

 

When SCC decided to contract out clearance in the sheepleas after the 1987 storm the contractors made an unnecessary mess and IMO excavating and burying stumps was damaging and pointless.

 

So having recently witnessed the untidy finish of their recent machine harvesting on common land adjacent to the M25 (which is no big worry as it will be mostly under the new J10) I'm a bit worried about the damage to soil structure and public amenity.

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1 hour ago, openspaceman said:
1 hour ago, Gary Prentice said:

 

I'm not sure of the science of the time-scale a natural resistance will build up but yes I think you are right  vast majority of the current population will be  susceptible

 

I'm not sure that resistance is built up over time, but think that they're genetically tolerant or they're not. 

I remember reading a few years back that over a period of ten years 98% of all ash in Denmark got infected. Which suggests that resistance isn't built up. But I don't know.

 

 

as an aside, I was writing a planting plan recently and with a view of increasing species diversity did a bit of research on the tolerance of other ash species. Basically there isn't any at all. 

I suppose that in two hundred yrs natural selection will sort everything out.

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13 minutes ago, Gary Prentice said:

I'm not sure that resistance is built up over time, but think that they're genetically tolerant or they're not. 

Yes but as time goes by the tolerant gene will be shared and will become dominat because the non tolerant saplings will succumb before reaching maturity and producing seed.

13 minutes ago, Gary Prentice said:

I remember reading a few years back that over a period of ten years 98% of all ash in Denmark got infected. Which suggests that resistance isn't built up. But I don't know.

I thought a lot of that was because ash was largely planted and the  favoured plants  with a good phenotype were susceptible.

 

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we only use skinny wedges and stack them if needed or use winch. There was a memo stating to not use hi lifts but cant remember from who. 
The article on the Fisa website deals with the use of wedges whilst felling ash suffering from dieback - the advice is not to use wedges to knock the tree over. The vibration caused by hit the wedge risks causing dead branches etc to snap off and fall onto the chainsaw operator. The advise winch assisted felling or use of a hydraulic/ratchet type wedge
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On 10/11/2018 at 17:12, steve collins said:

I know you have the kit, But can an excavator with a grapple saw cut accurately to length?  or will it go through a bed processor aswell? no different to a harvester or highly skilled handcutters?? imo

 

As im sure the trees being cut would have to be sold on as firewood.

 

Its all down cost at the end of the day

 

 

 

I think you’ll find it should be all down to Safety and cost should be a secondary consideration?

If they have the room then they’ll crash them over, if they want them taken down in controlled sections without any manual intervention then I can offer something far more effective and safer than any Harvester.

As for cut to length, I wouldn’t look at it as essential to have it exact, plenty of outlets and transport options always available, but it’s near enough if I wanted it to be and I’ve no issues handling after.

 

Harvesters are strong bits of kit, but lifting and handling is where Material Handlers excel.

 

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4 hours ago, Plodalong said:
On 11/11/2018 at 11:14, steve collins said:
we only use skinny wedges and stack them if needed or use winch. There was a memo stating to not use hi lifts but cant remember from who. 

The article on the Fisa website deals with the use of wedges whilst felling ash suffering from dieback - the advice is not to use wedges to knock the tree over. The vibration caused by hit the wedge risks causing dead branches etc to snap off and fall onto the chainsaw operator. The advise winch assisted felling or use of a hydraulic/ratchet type wedge

"It is essential then that operators retreat fully into their escape route when the tree begins to fall and that the use of traditional wedge techniques is minimised."

 

" If traditional wedges are used then it is preferable to use wedges with a more acute angle than traditional high-lift wedges these are driven into the tree with less force, the thought being that this will create less vibration and will therefore dislodge less deadwood"

 

cant see anything about winch assisting, the way i read it is they still allow the use of wedges all down to how its interpreted really.

 

https://www.ukfisa.com/assets/files/alerts/Safety Guidance Note - Felling dead ash - April 2018.pdf

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, LGP Eddie said:

I think you’ll find it should be all down to Safety and cost should be a secondary consideration?

If they have the room then they’ll crash them over, if they want them taken down in controlled sections without any manual intervention then I can offer something far more effective and safer than any Harvester.

As for cut to length, I wouldn’t look at it as essential to have it exact, plenty of outlets and transport options always available, but it’s near enough if I wanted it to be and I’ve no issues handling after.

 

Harvesters are strong bits of kit, but lifting and handling is where Material Handlers excel.

 

Eddie.D0D4BECE-8CF9-4C79-B07F-09AD43284727.thumb.jpeg.43c4799565ebff8beb4a85ac8d582975.jpeg909E5C6B-8CE3-4DA2-9614-54BF7091326C.thumb.jpeg.a7274bc0f7d44188026af84be1e6feb9.jpeg54EBCDBC-987D-4374-A512-05AA2D7268F1.thumb.jpeg.bbbb7af3b935c28755762fe81a97cc58.jpeg

 

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The problem is saftey and cost go hand in hand tho, lets hope there are no accidents on this job !!

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