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Apprencticeships / Employment Status


AA Teccie (Paul)
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Hi all, a none 'AA Teccie' question you may be able to help with.

 

My son, 17yrs, is trying to secure an apprenticeship with a local business who operates as a 'sole trader.' Whilst he is open minded to the possibility of the apprenticeship he doesn't currently have any other 'employees' and doesn't want to get embroiled in PAYE / National Insurance / Pensions etc. etc., understandable.

 

Assuming this may be required, can an apprentice also register as self-employed and invoice the 'employer' for the hours they work?

 

A bit messy, acknowledged, but I'm keen to try and make this work.

 

Is anyone out there a 'sole trader' with an apprentice and how does it work with regard to PAYE etc?

 

Thanks in anticipation all..

Paul (Smith, Dad n general "dogs body" :001_rolleyes:)

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Hi Paul, he would need more than one source of income to be self employed, however the wages for apprentices don't generally qualify for tax. The PAYE system is now very easy as it can be done online and worked out for you, gone are the days of those bloody tax tables

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Who is running the apprenticeship scheme and can they offer advice?

 

On another note I contract out my payroll, they do all the paperwork and all I do is make the actual payments each month. Makes it very simple and only costs about £15 a month.

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When I did a similar thing through Capel Manor and the City of London everybody there had to be employed with a firm as opposed to self employed. I believe it had something to do with the funding aspect of the course and the fact that they get some of the tickets paid for - although this may have changed in recent years

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My nephew did an arb apprenticeship recently and he transferred from the company he had started with to self employed part way through the training/apprenticeship. He's only just finished the apprenticeship and won't have had to put in a tax return yet so I don't know if he will get grief from the inland revenue but I was surprised that a) he'd had to do it / been encouraged to and b) been able to. I personally think it's a really bad idea for him as he's not business minded and would have suggested that he stick with an employer if at all possible (for what it's worth I'm self employed in a different line of business but a tad older ofc!) but I only found out after the event.

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If your lad is on the apprentice minimum wage rate, then the weekly wage payment will be below the £112 threshold where PAYE needs to operated. Any more than £112 then the guy hes working for will need to register for and operate PAYE. I sure there are ways your lad can have his wages " topped up"!

 

Going self employed as an apprentice is a bit risky as there is no way he could argue with the revenue he fulfils the self employed tests- control, substitution, MOO!

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If the potential employer doesn't want to 'get embroiled' in PAYE etc, I'd be concerned that other systems, such as safety and insurance, which are more onerous, were not being 'embroiled' in either.

A 17 year old, no matter how capable and mature, still requires a good deal of care and attention, especially in our industry. He is still growing physically and mentally and this requires a fair amount of both energy and rest.

The difficulty we face as parents is the balance between guiding/advising and allowing our children to learn by their own mistakes. Always a tricky balance.

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